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1jordyzzz
Platinum Member
Joined: 03 Mar 2012
Posts: 688
Location: Indonesia
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 Posted: Wed Apr 04, 2012 10:54 am Post subject: questions about kronos' piano... |
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1. is it fully editable (in any ways that's possible)?
2. does it have something called "symphatetic string resonance"? i saw nord stage 2 on youtube and it's pretty cool with it's symphatetic string resonance.. i just think that the symphatetic string resonance is a thing that makes a piano achieve it's natural ambience..
3. is the piano sample directly accessed from the SSD?? is the sgx-1 engine didn't use any ram at all???
thx 4 your answers...
still waiting for my kronos |
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michelkeijzers
Approved Merchant
Joined: 08 Feb 2007
Posts: 9113
Location: Netherlands
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| Posted: Wed Apr 04, 2012 11:40 am Post subject: Re: questions about kronos' piano... |
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| 1jordyzzz wrote: | 1. is it fully editable (in any ways that's possible)?
2. does it have something called "symphatetic string resonance"? i saw nord stage 2 on youtube and it's pretty cool with it's symphatetic string resonance.. i just think that the symphatetic string resonance is a thing that makes a piano achieve it's natural ambience..
3. is the piano sample directly accessed from the SSD?? is the sgx-1 engine didn't use any ram at all???
thx 4 your answers...
still waiting for my kronos |
First, there are three kinds of pianos: the acoustic piano model, electric piano model, and ' only' samples based (HD1).
You cannot change everything on the models, but that's not the intention, because it is a real representation of the instrument. Also 'in any what that is possible' is impossible or at least completely unuseful.
2: don't know
3 yes it is streamed from the SSD, but not 100%. Because as soon as you hit a key a sound is generated and even an SSD would be too slow for that. So the beginning of each sample is in RAM. I don't know how many % but only a small percentage of the complete amount.
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Developer of the free PCG file managing application for most Korg workstations: PCG Tools, see https://www.kronoshaven.com/pcgtools/ |
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SeedyLee
Platinum Member
Joined: 13 Sep 2006
Posts: 1371
Location: Perth, Australia
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| Posted: Wed Apr 04, 2012 12:14 pm Post subject: Re: questions about kronos' piano... |
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| 1jordyzzz wrote: | 1. is it fully editable (in any ways that's possible)?
2. does it have something called "symphatetic string resonance"? |
I believe it does, however it is called "damper resonance".
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Current Equipment:
Korg Kronos 2 88, Reface CS, Roland JV-1080, TE OP1, Moog Subsequent 37, Korg ARP Odyssey, Allen & Heath Zed 18, Adam F5, MOTU MIDI Express XT, Lexicon MX200 & MPX1, Yamaha QY700, Yamaha AW16G, Tascam DP008ex, Zoom H6, Organelle, Roland J6 & JU06A
Previous: Triton LE 61/Sampling/64MB/4GB SCSI, MS2000BR, Kronos 1 61, Monotribe, NanoKontrol, NanoKeys, Kaossilator II, Casio HT3000, Roland VP-03, Reface DX, Novation Mininova, MPC One |
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SanderXpander
Platinum Member
Joined: 29 Jul 2011
Posts: 7860
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| Posted: Wed Apr 04, 2012 2:05 pm Post subject: |
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| Damper resonance is not the same thing as sympathetic string resonance. |
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runningman67
Platinum Member
Joined: 06 Aug 2011
Posts: 1663
Location: Manchester UK
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| Posted: Wed Apr 04, 2012 2:24 pm Post subject: |
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some of the less 'headline' type piano's sound better in a mix, to my ear. Although the 'headline HD1' pianos are beautiful, they can overwhelm the mix, where other sounds are used.
Hope you get your Kronos soon.
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SeedyLee
Platinum Member
Joined: 13 Sep 2006
Posts: 1371
Location: Perth, Australia
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| Posted: Wed Apr 04, 2012 2:26 pm Post subject: |
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| SanderXpander wrote: | | Damper resonance is not the same thing as sympathetic string resonance. |
I was under the impression that damper resonance was a form of sympathetic string resonance that occured when the damper pedal was depressed?
If it's not this, then what is damper resonance?
_________________
Current Equipment:
Korg Kronos 2 88, Reface CS, Roland JV-1080, TE OP1, Moog Subsequent 37, Korg ARP Odyssey, Allen & Heath Zed 18, Adam F5, MOTU MIDI Express XT, Lexicon MX200 & MPX1, Yamaha QY700, Yamaha AW16G, Tascam DP008ex, Zoom H6, Organelle, Roland J6 & JU06A
Previous: Triton LE 61/Sampling/64MB/4GB SCSI, MS2000BR, Kronos 1 61, Monotribe, NanoKontrol, NanoKeys, Kaossilator II, Casio HT3000, Roland VP-03, Reface DX, Novation Mininova, MPC One |
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MRedZac
Senior Member
Joined: 18 Dec 2011
Posts: 374
Location: Germany
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| Posted: Wed Apr 04, 2012 2:28 pm Post subject: |
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| SanderXpander wrote: | | Damper resonance is not the same thing as sympathetic string resonance. |
But what is it then ? Some fake by Nord ?
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Keys+Sound Sources: Kronos 61, X2, X3, i3, i30, SG pro X, nanoPAD2, Yamaha MU100R, 2x CME UF70, Behringer FCB-1010, Yamaha FC-7
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PianoManChuck
Platinum Member
Joined: 09 Aug 2011
Posts: 832
Location: Los Angeles, CA
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| Posted: Wed Apr 04, 2012 4:15 pm Post subject: |
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Kronos pianos do NOT have string resonance.
Kronos pianos DO have damper resonance.
Nord pianos have both!
String Resonance:
Any keys that are held down (even so lightly as to not produce a note) will resonate when another key in the same harmonic frequency is played.
Damper Resonance:
The noise that you hear on a real piano when you depress and release the damper (sustain) pedal.
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runningman67
Platinum Member
Joined: 06 Aug 2011
Posts: 1663
Location: Manchester UK
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| Posted: Wed Apr 04, 2012 4:37 pm Post subject: |
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| PianoManChuck wrote: | Kronos pianos do NOT have string resonance.
Kronos pianos DO have damper resonance.
Nord pianos have both!
String Resonance:
Any keys that are held down (even so lightly as to notU produce a note) will resonate when another key in the same harmonic frequency is played.
Damper Resonance:
The noise that you hear on a real piano when you depress and release the damper (sustain) pedal. |
That's just what I was going to say lol 
Your the man Chuck!
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Zeroesque
Senior Member
Joined: 17 Jan 2011
Posts: 451
Location: SoCal
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| Posted: Wed Apr 04, 2012 4:52 pm Post subject: |
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| PianoManChuck wrote: | Kronos pianos do NOT have string resonance.
Kronos pianos DO have damper resonance.
Nord pianos have both!
String Resonance:
Any keys that are held down (even so lightly as to not produce a note) will resonate when another key in the same harmonic frequency is played.
Damper Resonance:
The noise that you hear on a real piano when you depress and release the damper (sustain) pedal. |
It should be noted that one has a far more audible effect on the sound (damper: all strings).
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Kronos 61, Kronos2-88, Hammond B3, Baldwin SD-10 |
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PianoManChuck
Platinum Member
Joined: 09 Aug 2011
Posts: 832
Location: Los Angeles, CA
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| Posted: Wed Apr 04, 2012 5:18 pm Post subject: |
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| Zeroesque wrote: | | PianoManChuck wrote: | Kronos pianos do NOT have string resonance.
Kronos pianos DO have damper resonance.
Nord pianos have both!
String Resonance:
Any keys that are held down (even so lightly as to not produce a note) will resonate when another key in the same harmonic frequency is played.
Damper Resonance:
The noise that you hear on a real piano when you depress and release the damper (sustain) pedal. |
It should be noted that one has a far more audible effect on the sound (damper: all strings). |
That's correct! Another way of looking at it is that the damper (sustain) pedal lifts all dampers off the strings, whereas holding notes down lift the dampers only off those strings. Either way, the strings with the dampers lifted off of them (via either method) will resonate when any harmonic key(s) are played.
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Last edited by PianoManChuck on Wed Apr 04, 2012 5:33 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Bruce Lychee
Platinum Member
Joined: 16 Jun 2011
Posts: 856
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| Posted: Wed Apr 04, 2012 5:26 pm Post subject: Re: questions about kronos' piano... |
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| michelkeijzers wrote: | | 1jordyzzz wrote: | 1. is it fully editable (in any ways that's possible)?
2. does it have something called "symphatetic string resonance"? i saw nord stage 2 on youtube and it's pretty cool with it's symphatetic string resonance.. i just think that the symphatetic string resonance is a thing that makes a piano achieve it's natural ambience..
3. is the piano sample directly accessed from the SSD?? is the sgx-1 engine didn't use any ram at all???
thx 4 your answers...
still waiting for my kronos |
First, there are three kinds of pianos: the acoustic piano model, electric piano model, and ' only' samples based (HD1).
You cannot change everything on the models, but that's not the intention, because it is a real representation of the instrument. Also 'in any what that is possible' is impossible or at least completely unuseful.
2: don't know
3 yes it is streamed from the SSD, but not 100%. Because as soon as you hit a key a sound is generated and even an SSD would be too slow for that. So the beginning of each sample is in RAM. I don't know how many % but only a small percentage of the complete amount. |
Since when is the SGX-1 a modeled piano engine? It isn't. It is a sample based engine. They might model a few of the effects, but in no way is it a modeled piano in the way of the V-piano, Pianoteq or even the SN pianos.
The SGX pianos have distinct velocity layers typical of a sample based piano. To say you can't adjust everything because you can't on real pianos doesn't even make sense. There are many adjustments that could be made to a real piano that you simply aren't accounted for in the SGX engine.
As someone who primarily plays acoustic, I also think sympathetic key resonance is important for solo playing. It definitely adds to the textures one can create with the a piano.
The only keyboards that have pianos with no velocity switching, no looping AND sympathetic key resonance (i.e. string resonance) are the V or SN pianos. I believe a smaller company is developing a modeled stage piano called Physis.
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michelkeijzers
Approved Merchant
Joined: 08 Feb 2007
Posts: 9113
Location: Netherlands
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| Posted: Wed Apr 04, 2012 10:30 pm Post subject: Re: questions about kronos' piano... |
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| Bruce Lychee wrote: |
Since when is the SGX-1 a modeled piano engine? It isn't. It is a sample based engine. They might model a few of the effects, but in no way is it a modeled piano in the way of the V-piano, Pianoteq or even the SN pianos.
The SGX pianos have distinct velocity layers typical of a sample based piano. To say you can't adjust everything because you can't on real pianos doesn't even make sense. There are many adjustments that could be made to a real piano that you simply aren't accounted for in the SGX engine.
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You are absolutely right. I worded my phrases a bit bad. With modeled I meant the non HD1 pianos. And yes, the base are still samples with modeled effects.
What I wanted to say with not being able to change everything was that it still should sound as a piano. If every possible parameter (whatever that may be) could be changed, the chance it would sound like a piano is very small.
Guess the missing parameters that cannot be changed while being possible to be changed on the piano gives Korg some work for SGX-2, 3 etc. 
Thank you for the clarification.
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Developer of the free PCG file managing application for most Korg workstations: PCG Tools, see https://www.kronoshaven.com/pcgtools/ |
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1jordyzzz
Platinum Member
Joined: 03 Mar 2012
Posts: 688
Location: Indonesia
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| Posted: Thu Apr 05, 2012 12:26 am Post subject: |
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ok thanks guyz! you're all very helpful (special thx to chuck and michelkeijzers) 
does anyone had an experience on playing classics (classical music) on the kronos??? how does it feel (the piano)? is it really convincing to do classics on those piano?? |
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PianoManChuck
Platinum Member
Joined: 09 Aug 2011
Posts: 832
Location: Los Angeles, CA
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| Posted: Thu Apr 05, 2012 12:31 am Post subject: |
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| 1jordyzzz wrote: | ok thanks guyz! you're all very helpful (special thx to chuck and michelkeijzers)
does anyone had an experience on playing classics (classical music) on the kronos??? how does it feel (the piano)? is it really convincing to do classics on those piano?? |
Yes - classical piano music feels great on the Kronos 88, and yes, even more convincing than some acoustic pianos out there. You basically have a Steinway D at your disposal (or you can spring an extra $249 for a Bosendorfer Imperial but overall, the Steinway D should more than suffice for classical).
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