PA800 sync problem

GDERGHAM · Post by **GDERGHAM** » Sat Dec 20, 2008 2:49 am

Hi,
I connect my pa800 as sleve device with nuendo (master).drop out sync appear. the tempo on pa800 not fix, going up and down.
I tried it with USB connect and midi ,still the same.even with old and new OS.
The same setup in my nuendo work fine with triton and yamaha .only i have this prob. with pa800.

GDERGHAM · Post by **GDERGHAM** » Sat Dec 20, 2008 10:52 am

No body have tried sync the pa800 before??????

Rob Sherratt · Post by **Rob Sherratt** » Sat Dec 20, 2008 11:00 am

GDERGHAM wrote:Hi,
I connect my pa800 as sleve device with nuendo (master).drop out sync appear. the tempo on pa800 not fix, going up and down.
I tried it with USB connect and midi ,still the same.even with old and new OS.
The same setup in my nuendo work fine with triton and yamaha .only i have this prob. with pa800.

I think the Pa800 clock source is not set correctly and it may be syncing from internal clock instead of Nuendo. You need to set and save the "Clock Source" parameter on the Pa800.

See Global -> MIDI -> MIDI Setup Gen.

Set clock source to Ext MIDI or Ext USB depending on which cable you are using.

Then write global - Midi setup.

Best regards,
Rob

GDERGHAM · Post by **GDERGHAM** » Sat Dec 20, 2008 11:20 am

thanks rob for reply

I did all setting but i didn't save global ,maybe the reason iwll try it and tell

GDERGHAM · Post by **GDERGHAM** » Sat Dec 20, 2008 11:34 am

Still make drop out ,the tempo unstablish not fix .

from my experience,my nuendo setup is right.I like to know from any body if he tried it(pa800 in sync) ,and it is working!!!!

Rob Sherratt · Post by **Rob Sherratt** » Sat Dec 20, 2008 12:15 pm

I've used external MIDI clock over USB to connect my Pa2x to Sonar on my PC. That worked fine after I made the settings on the Pa2x I just described. I don't think there is any known fault with Pa800 external clock sync. Anyway I've run out of guesses what is going wrong, maybe someone else can help now?

Regards,
rob

GDERGHAM · Post by **GDERGHAM** » Sat Dec 20, 2008 12:27 pm

any way thanks for reply .

so,I will try it with another software sequencer.but what is strange I use to use the nuendo more then 1 year sync with triton work fine .this happen with pa800.
any way thanks for your help

Rob Sherratt · Post by **Rob Sherratt** » Sat Dec 20, 2008 1:43 pm

Just another thought:

You say the tempo on the Pa800 is going up and down. I think it has to be something wrong on your PC since that is the controller. Just to prove the point I am making, please try another external keyboard such as your Triton.

Regards,
Rob

GDERGHAM · Post by **GDERGHAM** » Sat Dec 20, 2008 2:48 pm

I thought the same what you thought about pc ,I did tried the triton is working perfect,i tried it in the same pc but diferent OS (second HD)-clean OS- still the same ,I tried it on 2 different sound card and 2 different connection(usb and midi) still the same the TEMPO go up and down not establish.
even I tried it with logic (pc v5.5) exactly the same problem.
I have to try it on my other pc .
thanks for your interesting.

vagro · Post by **vagro** » Sat Jan 10, 2009 11:41 pm

I have the same problem with my Pa500. It has the latest PA500 OS version 1.18 which repaired a bug in the tempo control. When the tempo is in external Usb clock (controlled by an external arranger through the usb port and a PC) and for example I set the external clock in 70 bpm the Pa keeps moving the tempo from 68 or 69 to 70 bpm all the time as if it was unstable but it still works. With the previous OS version I coudn't sync the Pa500 at all.

rikkisbears · Post by **rikkisbears** » Sun Jan 11, 2009 12:40 am

Hi,
I haven't tried it recently. But I think I also had a problem with my PA800 as a slave, to a piece of software I sometimes use, called Busker.
The clock on my PA800 started to go jittery when set as slave
ie rapidly up & down.
I thought it might have had something to do with my software because normally it's used with a psr.

Fortunately for me I have the option of either setting ie korg as master or slave, so I didn't persevere.

I haven't had a chance to try what Rob suggested as yet.

[quote="GDERGHAM"]Hi,
I connect my pa800 as sleve device with nuendo (master).drop out sync appear. the tempo on pa800 not fix, going up and down.

adminrxb · Post by **adminrxb** » Wed Jan 14, 2009 6:09 am

Same problem here with Cubase 4 and Pa800. Pa800 tempo will jump +-2 like jittering in external USB slave mode. "Use System Timestamp" is enabled in Cubase 4 which corrects some midi timing issues but still no improvement.

Rob Sherratt · Post by **Rob Sherratt** » Wed Jan 14, 2009 8:35 am

A few snippets of technical information might help ...

1. MIDI clock is a series of pulses. When any instrument receives an external MIDI clock, it has to measure the separation time interval between the pulses and then convert this to a frequency (eg 70 bpm).

2. We should expect a certain amount of "jitter" in any instrument receiving an external MIDI clock, especially when the MIDI clock is generated from a Windoze machine. If the nominal rate is 70 bmp, then seeing the bpm change frequently between 68 and 72 would not worry me at all. You could not "hear" this when the instrument is played.

3. There is more jitter in the MIDI clock pulse ignals if you are using MIDI over USB compared with using a dedicated MIDI IN "5 pin DIN" cable.

4. There would be less jitter from a Macintosh because the operating system creates less timing uncertainty for real-time events such as MIDI. That is why many musicians prefer a Mac-based platform for music compared with a Windoze based platform.

5. If using the same dedicated "5 pin DIN" MIDI cables plugged into either a Pa800 or a Triton or any other keyboard, we should expect the same amount of MIDI clock "jitter" to be noticed on all the keyboards when the clock source is externally generated on a PC based platform. Perhaps someone who has both a TRITON and a Pa800 / Pa2x could verify this?

Best regards,
Rob

Rob Sherratt · Post by **Rob Sherratt** » Wed Jan 14, 2009 8:42 am

GDERGHAM wrote:I thought the same what you thought about pc ,I did tried the triton is working perfect,i tried it in the same pc but diferent OS (second HD)-clean OS- still the same ,I tried it on 2 different sound card and 2 different connection(usb and midi) still the same the TEMPO go up and down not establish.
even I tried it with logic (pc v5.5) exactly the same problem.
I have to try it on my other pc .
thanks for your interesting.

Hello again GDERGHAM,

Please can you confirm ...

1. when you connected to the TRITON were you using EXTERNAL midi clock - ie the clock was generated by the PC and not the TRITON? I would expect the TRITON to display the same timing uncertainties as the Pa800 / Pa2x.

2. are you using the same pair of MIDI "5-pin DIN" cables to connect either to the TRITON or to the Pa800 / Pa2x ?

3. is the software sequencer configuration on the PC identical in both cases?

4. are you replaying the identical General MIDI music file both times?

Best regards,
Rob

kid_late · Post by **kid_late** » Wed Jan 14, 2009 11:40 am

I think the only thing that would work really stable is if the Pa could sync to or from a MTC midi time code,and it is one of my biggest wishes, that Korg will impliment MTC in the next OS.This would make the Pa much more useable in studie setups.And Rob I remember we have had this discussion a few months ago.Cubase does not synck to a midi clock ,only
MTC.Rob if you would mention this to some of the guys from Korg it would be great.

Regards
Kid late

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