Karma on OpenLab - THE nail into the coffin of OASYS

Discussion relating to the Korg Oasys Workstation.

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vEddY
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Post by vEddY »

peter m. mahr wrote: out of curiosity and although being off topic may this generel question be allowed - what is the reason for a company to join such a trade show like the NAMM if there are nearly no new products presented or announced?
peter
Well, you can look at it from two different perspectives if you will. First thing that I feel is absolutely true is that the market is changing, and even though it might not be that apparent, so are companies' strategies and therefor their products. If you take a look at the stuff Korg has been doing in the past couple of years and the focus they put into different areas other then workstations, I'd say you have some answers there. And that's not a bad thing, as well, because some of the innovations they did are pretty much astonishing. I mean, DS-10 for Nintendo? That's freakin' cool!

Second thing, NAMM is, in music industry, a place to be at. So is Frankfurt Messe, but for whatever reason I can tell you this - I prefer going to NAMM over Messe any day of the week. Not only because it's earlier in the year, although it's a big part usually. Messe tends to be the "let's repeat NAMM in Europe" thing in terms of products. And that's a waste of time for many people, myself included. So, NAMM is kind of a... inertion thing. You just gotta be there.

In all "fairness", I think that M3 also did all sorts of weird stuff to Korg. I have a strong feeling that the catching-up game they've been playing with M3 and the big "hole" they left on their own market by discontinnuing Triton Extreme before M3 was ready, while putting a lot of time and effort into M3 XP development is something that cost them. I just hope that they finally come to terms with some strategies because there's been way too much confused decisions by them in the recent months and years.
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danatkorg
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Post by danatkorg »

peter m. mahr wrote:
vEddY wrote:.... why I'm kind of sorry that KORG didn't have any "really big" announcements for this year's NAMM.
out of curiosity and although being off topic may this generel question be allowed - what is the reason for a company to join such a trade show like the NAMM if there are nearly no new products presented or announced?

peter
For a manufacturer, the main purpose of the NAMM show is to interact with the people who buy inventory for music stores (dealers). For an established manufacturer, the company's sales people meet with all of their dealers, and makes sales arrangements for the upcoming year. January NAMM comes after the holiday buying season, when dealers need to re-stock; Summer NAMM comes before the back-to-school season.

Product announcements can help to sell more product to dealers, but they aren't the primary reason for going to the show.

- Dan
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peter m. mahr
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Post by peter m. mahr »

thanks for the explanations.

interesting to read that the company's sales people meet with their dealers at the NAMM. i always thought that they meet on a regular bases in the stores to discuss these issues, eg at the end of the year the arrangements for the next year.

interesting as well is the Summer NAMM before the back to school season. do people then still have money in their wallets? or is this timepoint important for the end of year sales (before x-mas)?

peter
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nitecrawler
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Post by nitecrawler »

"out of curiosity and although being off topic may this generel question be allowed - what is the reason for a company to join such a trade show like the NAMM if there are nearly no new products presented or announced?"

I would think that the current thought is that you create more industry rumours with your absense than you do with a subpar presentation, re new products. We all understand that new product development can not always align itsef for timely show presentations. Announcements would be a nice counterpoint to lack of new presentations; but alas, that (pre-annoucements) is not the Korg way. Basically, you take a hit either way. :roll:

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peter m. mahr
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Post by peter m. mahr »

"I would think that the current thought is that you create more industry rumours with your absense than you do with a subpar presentation, re new products."

in the field i am working more and more big companies (brands) do no longer present themselves on trade shows. for several reasons, but this business is organised completely different to music, therefore i was curious.

peter
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laughing_bear
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Post by laughing_bear »

Just stumbled across this thread....

I think, Korg made a lot of poor decisions with reference to KARMA Marketing, from the beginning on, this was not pushed as much as it deserved. Most of the people around here know exactly what I am talking about, across countries and continents, the experience was the very same, poorly educated sales people, incompetent to demo a complex innovative Midi product, confused prospective buyers who would not really get the message.

At first, I thought this is a unique experience because here in ireland the clocks tick different anyways, but quickly it emerged that such and worse was happening all over the world where the original burgundy beast was introduced.

I know, this is going back a long time, but as an early adopter, this was something I wondered about from day one and expressed that, may be sometimes a bit blunt, but hey, I am known for to call a spade a spade! :wink:

Korg has succeeded to maintain and keep touch with the user basis, but this is also due to the "utterly insane levels of work" Stephen has put into supporting KARMA. I yet have to come across anyone who is so devoted and supports users regardless what question they ask.

On the other side, there was a very active user base, and this helped Korg and KARMA in return to fine tune and develop the application at hand, last not least Stephens innovative drive and the ideas he constantly worked on.

Early I suggested to Stephen not to put all his eggs in one basket, also because I was convinced this technology to be applicable in many ways, it is just the best thing since MIDI in my personal hall of fame, and many I know agree with that judgement.

I am delighted he made this step, and I can imagine this not to be the last step of KARMA to be made available for a wider user base. It is just too good to only be part of a very narrow market segment.

....

I could go on with that, but I think the bottom line is this. If I would be Korg.... just for fun...

KARMA would have become more than a temporary love affair, much much more in deed, and I think at Korg they failed to see the real value.

Frankly, I was shocked to the bone when I saw the M50 announcement!

I read it twice, not trusting my eyes, strongly believing I must have missed the KARMA 2 section, but I did not!

Shaking my head in disbelief at yet another extremly poor marketing decision, I thought, well, it is about time that Stephen knocks on doors again, and well, I am flippin delighted he did!!!!

Korg missed to turn KARMA into a 100% Korg asset, and boy, they had all the balls in their own park to secure this. I have no doubts, they will regret this....
peter m. mahr
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Post by peter m. mahr »

laughing_bear wrote:.... I yet have to come across anyone who is so devoted and supports users regardless what question they ask.
absolutely right !!!

peter
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danatkorg
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Post by danatkorg »

peter m. mahr wrote:thanks for the explanations.

interesting to read that the company's sales people meet with their dealers at the NAMM. i always thought that they meet on a regular bases in the stores to discuss these issues, eg at the end of the year the arrangements for the next year.
The larger manufacturers have large areas of the booth set aside, often separately walled-off, for meeting with dealers.
peter m. mahr wrote:interesting as well is the Summer NAMM before the back to school season. do people then still have money in their wallets? or is this timepoint important for the end of year sales (before x-mas)?
peter
I believe it's important for band and orchestra instruments, since demand for these matches the school year. Summer is also a guitar-heavy show. I assume that it also serves as a time to adjust stock for the holiday season, when necessary.

- Dan
Dan Phillips
Manager of Product Development, Korg R&D
Personal website: www.danphillips.com
For technical support, please contact your Korg Distributor: http://www.korg.co.jp/English/Distributors/
Regretfully, I cannot offer technical support directly.
If you need to contact me for purposes other than technical support, please do not send PMs; instead, send email to dan@korgrd.com
peter m. mahr
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Post by peter m. mahr »

thanks Dan.

peter
billysynth1
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Post by billysynth1 »

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StephenKay
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Post by StephenKay »

billysynth1 wrote:Here is Stephen at NAMM

http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=IoX3SJo7m ... re=channel
Wow, horrible video and audio. :)

I will have a much better version of this up in the next few days.
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mdh
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Post by mdh »

danatkorg wrote: Product announcements can help to sell more product to dealers, but they aren't the primary reason for going to the show.

- Dan
If it was, I'd go make my own show. With blackjack, and hookers!

:twisted:
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StephenKay
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Post by StephenKay »

StephenKay wrote:
billysynth1 wrote:Here is Stephen at NAMM

http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=IoX3SJo7m ... re=channel
Wow, horrible video and audio. :)

I will have a much better version of this up in the next few days.
Just to wrap up the loose ends, in case anyone follows this thread to this point in the future:

http://www.karma-lab.com/vp/klvp.html?playID=300
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Davidb
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Post by Davidb »

Stephen, thanx for the link.

Let me tell you that the vid is great, as always, but let me add that the implementation of the Karma Tecnology in the Open Labs system is awsome.

I really think as today, that the Open Lab plattform is the perfect host to KARMA, IMHO.

I wish you the very best in this new adventure.
Thanx again and regards.
Regards.
D.
MauroR

Post by MauroR »

Stephen I'm without words, you're a genius. I'm waiting for more videos from you. ;)
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