Still confused about STS's. songbook STS's???

Grey · Post by **Grey** » Tue Mar 10, 2009 9:01 pm

Hello guys,

I'm glad that this topic came up as it seems like there's a definite need in many others, beside just me, to improve on the flexibility (among other things) of the Korg PA flagship keyboards. I hope Korg listens!

It's been 4 years since I wrote a 16-page letter to Korg, describing in exact detail what they need to do to improve on the design of then their flagship PA1X Pro. Some of the requests are there by now in the PA2X but very far from all of them (and I'm only talking about USEFUL, not a science-fiction type of features) . I hope that the currently running survey will remind them, as I did my part there...

The particular 2 features having to do with Styles and STS settings that have been missing in the PA line all along are:

1) Hold All STS switch (with lock) on the main Style Play page.
Allows for all STS locations of the selected style to remain unchanged when the next style or a Song Book entry is selected.

2) Hold Style switch (with lock) on the main Style Play page.
Allows for all current STS locations to change to all of the STSs of any other style or a Song Book entry without changing the currently selected style in any way.

I only have the PA1X Pro, but correct me if I'm wrong, I don't believe that these are there on PA2X Pro.

It's only logical to have these features on this kind of an instrument, and I'm not even talking about doubling the number of STSs per style and adding banks of empty Performance locations to store new STSs in.

macboy · Post by **macboy** » Thu Mar 12, 2009 11:51 am

When the SINGLE TOUCH button is off, all performances that you use at the moment, will not change. This is very usefull of course, since sometimes you just want to change the style without the sounds/performances.

However, the 4 STS buttons sometimes prove so good for people, that they want to keep the 4 STS performances, even when they change the performance.

Of course this is something which is not possible right now, because the 4 STS buttons are much more greater than for example the Yamaha STS buttons (don't know how they are called).

I can understand that people always want to have 4 or 8 "perfect instruments" ready on a button touch.

However, that is not how Korg created them. Korg created them much more better and complex, that is that they will change with every style, so you can setup your wish list STS for every single style.

If people do not want the STS to change, you have to individually change all STS for every style. This is doable, however, not logical.

Therefore I think it would be a great and simple feature for Korg to make an extra LOCK button, to lock the STS whenever you would want, so that when you change a style, the STS will not change !

Should be a simple task ?

For the time being I suggest people to save their 8 best performances all in one bank, so that you can easily select them. Then you do not need the 4 STS separately for "perfect instruments".

And if you press STS or if you press BANK 1 performance, does not make much difference for how long it takes. Only problem is that when selecting performance, you are not in the main menu.

Ron · Post by **Ron** » Fri Mar 13, 2009 10:45 am

It's good to know that several of us want the same thing, that is, to keep the same STS settings when we change styles. I'm sorry for the confusion that I caused because I truly thought this was what was intended when the Single Touch LED was OFF.

I hesitate to suggest how to implement this but I would be very happy if the Single Touch LED OFF mode could become exactly this. It really is not very useful to me in its present form where only the current KB settings are kept when changing styles and then only to be lost as soon as another STS is selected.

Thanks to all of you who helped me to understand how this really works.

Now the question becomes whether there is enough interest by enough people to warrant a change in a future OS update and, if so, how do we let Korg know we would appreciate this consideration.

I tried to express my thoughts in the current survey but did not do a very good job because I really did not understand the issue.

I know there is a wishlist thread on the forum. It contains a lot of good ideas but also a great deal of discussion that makes it difficult to sort this from that. I've also seen other good ideas elsewhere on this forum that are not in the wishlist. I would like to assume that someone (maybe the moderators?) consolidates these ideas and passes them to Korg in some manner. If this is not true, we ought to figure out how to do this, especially since Korg is currently seeking customer feedback.

ozgur234 · Post by **ozgur234** » Fri Mar 13, 2009 2:21 pm

Ron, you are absoulately correct. I always assumed the same thing about the single touch led, and was disappointed as well. To work around this problem, I copy my most favorite performances into the very first page of the performances and keep my screen locked so I can access them easily. One other but tedious solution could be changing the STSs of every single style to your four performances, and redo it every time there is a new resource file update arrrgghhhhhhhh.

Cheers,

Ozgur

Rob Sherratt · Post by **Rob Sherratt** » Fri Mar 13, 2009 4:48 pm

Ron wrote:It's good to know that several of us want the same thing, that is, to keep the same STS settings when we change styles. I'm sorry for the confusion that I caused because I truly thought this was what was intended when the Single Touch LED was OFF.

Hi Ron,

I don't want the same thing as that, sorry.

As you know, when you change style, all the style track sound asignments and volume settings change. ie Drum kit, Perc kit, Bass instrument, and the Acc1 to 5 instruments completely change, just like you brought on a new band. I thought that was what you wanted to stop happening.

So I'm surprised that you are evidently still focussed on the locking of STS issue which has nothing at all to do with the matter of preventing your band walking off stage to be replaced by a completely different set of instrumentalists.

In my opinion it is much more important to have a mechanism for locking the present sound and other audio assignments, ie so your band stays the same when you select a different style, and the current "band" will continue playing the same instruments but using a different musical genre/pattern.

Best regards,
Rob

Reuben · Post by **Reuben** » Fri Mar 13, 2009 11:04 pm

Hi Ron, Rob and others,
On my Pa1x I've found the best work around is the Songbook. The Songbook gives you FOUR STS for anything you put into it. You leave your Single Touch Light on and your favourite 4 STS can be always available for any Style or Midi. This makes much more sense than just changing the Style itself because you can have tempo or other settings change if you wish. This has got to be faster than searching for a style, adjusting tempo etc. just choose by the name of your song and you are underway with 4 STS's. You can even have Chords and Lyrics available for any Song no matter if its Style based or Midi based. I even use the Songbook simply as a "dumb" setting selector when playing the intrument without backing - eg, Piano & Strings STS's. When saving it I call the Genre "Set" so if I filter by "Set" the Songbook only lists my favourite Settings.
All the best,
John

macboy · Post by **macboy** » Mon Mar 16, 2009 11:12 am

I would like to state again that the 4 STS buttons are almost unique and a very very great feature from Korg because it has been added to EVERY SINGLE style.

This normally would be the best thing ever

However, a simple STS lock function would be simple and solving for some. Until then: like mentioned above just put your 8 perf in bank 1 and lock it for simple and effective use.

rbalaa · Post by **rbalaa** » Tue Apr 28, 2009 5:46 pm

macboy wrote:Until then: like mentioned above just put your 8 perf in bank 1 and lock it for simple and effective use.

I think most of us agree that selecting different instruments using a physical button (STSs) is much more convenient than using the touch screen and this is what Ron is getting at.

I bought this keyboard just over a week ago and was just wondering the same thing before browsing this thread.

Thanks Rob for all your notes on this forum that help us understand the concept of this keyboard.

Rob, I agree with Ron about the "Single touch" LED being off. This is not about what if a real band has to switch instruments with a different beat or whatever the case may be ... Its about having fun with this great keyboard, and eveyone has different methods of doing so (some work on it, some use it as a hobby ...

Here's the situation were this keyboard is fun for me to play with. For me, and I think Ron and others agree with this, If I download 20 new styles and I want to use the SAME 4 instruments for these 20 new styles specifically. Then I should be able to do so with a "lock" feature for STSs, now whether the "Single Touch" button should do so or not, that's up to Korg and your help (my belief was that the "off" LED allows for this). The reason why it should be STSs and NOT Performances is because I need to have physical buttons for quick access (it feels better when playing live).

I don't mean to beat on this topic. I just wanted to give my input on this topic because I too was confused regarding the "Single Touch" LED function. I shouldn't have to program 20 different styles to get them to use the same 4 instruments. It doesn't make sense to have a funtion that keeps one and only one STS for a different style, why not keep ALL four.

Thank you all.

Ramzi

mrniceneasy · Post by **mrniceneasy** » Tue Apr 28, 2009 6:11 pm

rbalaa wrote:
I don't mean to beat on this topic. I just wanted to give my input on this topic because I too was confused regarding the "Single Touch" LED function. I shouldn't have to program 20 different styles to get them to use the same 4 instruments. It doesn't make sense to have a function that keeps one and only one STS for a different style, why not keep ALL four.

Thank you all.

Ramzi

I would also like to see this feature as I convert a lot of styles from other Brands and it would be easier initially to add the same sts in one go to each style. They could then be further tweaked to suit each style.

Paolo@Korg · Post by **Paolo@Korg** » Wed Apr 29, 2009 10:15 am

Hi,

To all that might be interested, please also check the tutorial devoted to the STS and Performances at our web site:

http://www.korgpa.com/pa_root/en/suppor ... ls.html?it

Best regards,
Paolo

jg:: · Post by **jg::** » Wed Apr 29, 2009 2:30 pm

I agree that a "STS Lock" function would be a logical addition to Pa functionality.

But here's another possibility for your consideration:

1. Turn off the SINGLE TOUCH button [so that changing styles/songs doesn't change Keyboard Tracks].

2. Go to Global > General Controls > Interface, and tick "Auto Performance Select". [If you like it this way, you'll want to save the Global settings.]

3. On the RH side of the panel, turn on Performance Select, and turn off Style Change.

Now, just one press of a Performance button selects the first Performance in that bank.

So, you can store your 10 favourite Performances [or STS] in the first slot of each of the 10 banks, and select those 10 with just one button press. It's like having 10 STS buttons, except that changing Styles or Songbook entries will not alter them!

In fact, press the button to select the lower row of Performance buttons, and you have yet another 10 Performances [or STS] ready to go with just one button press again.

If you only need 4 Performances [STS], that's fine. You might even find the Performance buttons easier to get to than the 4 STS buttons or the display.

jg::

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rbalaa · Post by **rbalaa** » Wed Apr 29, 2009 6:55 pm

jg:: wrote:I agree that a "STS Lock" function would be a logical addition to Pa functionality.

But here's another possibility for your consideration:

1. Turn off the SINGLE TOUCH button [so that changing styles/songs doesn't change Keyboard Tracks].

2. Go to Global > General Controls > Interface, and tick "Auto Performance Select". [If you like it this way, you'll want to save the Global settings.]

3. On the RH side of the panel, turn on Performance Select, and turn off Style Change.

Now, just one press of a Performance button selects the first Performance in that bank.

So, you can store your 10 favourite Performances [or STS] in the first slot of each of the 10 banks, and select those 10 with just one button press. It's like having 10 STS buttons!

Then, press the button to select the lower row of Performance buttons, and you have yet another 10 Performances [or STS] ready to go with just one button press again.

If you only need 4 Performances [STS], that's fine. You might even find the Performance buttons easier to get to than the 4 STS buttons.

jg::

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This is perhaps the best alternative I've heard.

I'm having a tough time using the touch screen to select a different performance (especially playing live), plus the fact that you don't see the main screen makes it even worse (the main screen on the PA is loaded with useful info).

The feel of a button changes everything when making a quick switch of instruments during play. Even though the STS instruments are labelled nicely on top using the "STS tab", I won't have time to program nearly 100 styles with 4 different tracks (instruments) each, not including when I get new styles ...

I would really like to see Korg help us out with this. Please read my reason to change "Single Touch" setting in the OFF mode.

Currently LED "OFF" keeps only the active STS (track, instrument, Perf ...) but reprograms the STSs for the style.

(Hypothetically speaking, prentend)
LED OFF: Locks ALL four STSs

Scenario: Change style while playing

If the musician wants to keep the active STS but reprogram the STSs for his new to be selected style, doesn't it make sense that he/she turn "OFF" style change, switch style, then turn back on to reprogram the STSs ? Note that he's still playing the sound from the previous style.

Currently the LED "ON" and "OFF" reprograms the STSs, two functions that practicly the same thing. This assists only certain type of musicians when it could be helping other types.

I know there are plenty that disagree with me, in that case please consider adding an STS "lock" function anywhere you please.

Anyways, I will give the method proposed by jg (above) a try. Very helpful, thanks again.

RB