Keeping your eye on the competition

[karmathanever]

Hi all

Although this a Korg-lovers Korg forum for Korg-loving Korgies like us - it is always fun to keep an eye on the competition.

I am talking here about the mysterious Ketron Audya. I am now believing that I will never ever actually see one where I live.
Like many, I was quite intrigued and somewhat excited about the Audya when it was first announced (just after WWII - I think )

Seriously, I cannot give any opinions about the keyboard and have enjoyed Nedim's feedback so far. Then recently I played this "preview" by AudioWorksCT and was somewhat surprised at the number of things that I would not like about the Ketron from a physical point of view (screen/button relationships in particular - would drive me mental).

Have a look at it and form your own view - it is not a sound/style preview but a physical structure preview.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GVTA2wvX4A8

Cheers

Pete

[macboy]

The button positioning on the Audya is sometimes just awfull. I noticed this immediately and even made an earlier remark about that on this forum in Nedim's post I think. There does not seem to be enough logic for positioning. Also the buttons itself look to small compared to the rest. Important buttons should be big enoug (e.g. fill button, voice button etc). Also when playing arranger with left hand, you want to fill and break and change the variations with your left hand. So positioning on left would be logical. However, some people want to do it with right hand, than positioning more on the right seems better. Ketron put it directly in the middle, thus having both camps a little happy. I would prefer one camp to be totally happy however

[karmathanever]

The two things that struck me were the buttons around the screen not lining up with the screen options and also the position of the USB ports

Pete

[Sam CA]

The two things that struck me were the buttons around the screen not lining up with the screen options and also the position of the USB ports

Pete

What would be the main reason for a keyboardist to spend $4000 over this? What is it so special about this keyboard that makes it stand out in the crowd?

[rikkisbears]

Hi,
the only thing I didn't like about my Ketron SD1+ was lack of style editing functions. No event list editor, no importing & exporting of style parts as midifiles etc etc

So far , the Audya doesn't appear to have much in the way of style editing functions either. Supposedly considering it it in vers 3 update.
Vers 2 was released recently.

Anyway my Sd1's now sold, so it doesn't bug me anymore.

[Sam CA]

[quote="rikkisbears"]

So far , the Audya doesn't appear to have much in the way of style editing functions either.quote]

That's the first thing that i'd be looking at ,if i was about to purchase a new arranger keyboard for extra buck. The fact that a new arranger keybaord has more factory styles is not considered an upgrade for me. I haven't done any research over Audya yet, but I have a feeling this is not going to be "The arranger keyboard" of the year.

[rikkisbears]

Hi Sam,
me too.

Just be interesting to see what functions they will include as part of style creation/editing. Hopefully more than what the passed off as style editing on the SD1+.
From what I've been reading over at the Synthzone General Arranger Keyboard forum, it appears to still be a work in progress.
Here in Aust. they'd have a hefty price tag, be interesting to see if we even get them.

Anyway, not looking to swap ( until the next model korg arrives, I'm a total convert. haaha) but I am thinking of maybe getting a V Machine to play vsti's for melody parts ( just to get additional sounds ).
James (Irishacts) has been very helpful on the subject over at synthzone. I've heard about v machine, but hadn't actually come across anyone who owned one, now I have. I've got a heap of reading up to do, before getting to see one. The proceeds from the sale of my sd1 are burning a hole in my pocket. haahaa


[quote="Assyrianpianist"][quote="rikkisbears"]

So far , the Audya doesn't appear to have much in the way of style editing functions either.quote]

That's the first thing that i'd be looking at ,if i was about to purchase a new arranger keyboard for extra buck.

[Sam CA]

[quote="rikkisbears"]

Anyway, not looking to swap ( until the next model korg arrives, I'm a total convert. haaha) but I am thinking of maybe getting a V Machine to play vsti's for melody parts ( just to get additional sounds ).
James (Irishacts) has been very helpful on the subject over at synthzone. I've heard about v machine, but hadn't actually come across anyone who owned one, now I have. I've got a heap of reading up to do, before getting to see one. The proceeds from the sale of my sd1 are burning a hole in my pocket. haahaa
[quote]

I know! I got a bonus check few weeks ago, and I've been suffering from new holes in my pockets as well. Gotta make a trip to the store soon!!!

I don't know much about V-machine. I've had receptor for 3 years now. It's a really cool machine, but expensive!

[rikkisbears]

Hi Sam,
nice one.
Unfortunately , for what I do, I couldn't justify the cost.
( not that it makes any sense me owning 3 keyboards & a digital piano either. At least I'm down to 2 now. Trying to bring some sanity back. haahaa)
The little V machine is relatively inexpensive and might just be what I'm looking for.

Well , with a Korg PA & a receptor , what could you possibly need. haahaa

I know! I got a bonus check few weeks ago, and I've been suffering from new holes in my pockets as well. Gotta make a trip to the store soon!!!

I don't know much about V-machine. I've had receptor for 3 years now. It's a really cool machine, but expensive!

[dermotm]

Hi all

I've just finished programming an Audya(styles, voices etc) and i have to say its a sizeable task. But i also have a Korg PA 50 and it takes an awful lot longer to program the Korg. Ketron have made a huge improvement on many of the voices. The guitars are fantastic, all of the woodwind and the drums would blow you away. Compare this to the Tyros 3. I programmed this keyboard too and the drums are predictable to say the least and repetative.

I would agree though that the layout is a bit silly then even from the Ketron XD9 which also has the same trouble. The Solton MS 60/100 series suffered from the same problem too.

Style programming is not easy but at least when the style is programmed, the individual instrument octaves are correct, this doesn't happen with my Korg and it drives me demented.
Ketron thought have thought about the styles logically and is very evident from Rock and Pop even as far as the Country genre.
Korg, which is a bit dissapointing given the quality of the voices, have a very weak Country style section and i myself have even ended up converting many of the Tyros 3 and Ketron SD 5 country styles for my Korg.

If i could afford it, i'd buy an Audya not only for its styles but i've found all the Korgs very weak and somewhat noisy when put through a decent sized PA system. The drums need a lot of EQ'ing internally and the guitars are too tinny even with EQ'ing. Whereas the Audya and all the Ketrons in general have big, beefy drums, full guitars and very real, in fact closer to real than the T3, electric guitars. Piano's are soft and not really useable in a live situation whereas the Korg would eat the Ketron alive in this department.

I'm only giving my opinion on this keyboard; i know people will disagree but overall and if i win the lottery i would buy this keyboard.
I still bring my PA50 gigging along with my XD9, its more user friendly and has better sounds for the music i play.

[BasariStudios]

I've just finished programming an Audya(styles, voices etc) and i have to say its a sizeable task.

Maybe missunderstood this but i work for the company itself on the Audya
devellopement itself too, as i know of Audya is not able to program styles
as of now yet, if you found a way, besides doing it on SD machines it would
be interesting to see how its done.

Comment on the rest:
Somewhere around OS 3.0 which will be soon Audya will feature a full Style
Editor inSynth and as a Software and also a full Sample Editor inSynth and
also as a software. It was supposed to be done in OS 2.0 but it wasnt finished
on my own requirements from the engineers when i asked for certain features
that would probably resemble some of the features we have on Korg arrangers.
Audya still has a long way to go but by then will also be way a head of the rest.
And no, i aint giving up on Korg's i might give up on 10 Audyas but not Korg.

[macboy]

Audya screen with bad positioning and not having a touch screen is a no go area Pete, but this was too obvious so I did not mention it

The pro of the Audya are the styles and sounds. Should be entering a total new world.

As to the remark of the PA output of the Korg machines: it is true compared to other brands and needs tweaking, but after that the problem is mainly solved.

It is like Porsche (Korg). It is a great machine, fairly good positioned in the market and has a good price compared to other brands in sports market. But if you want a custom made car (Audya) it will be more expensive. That does not mean it will be better than the Porsche, but on some things it definitely will blow you away. If it is worth the money is all depending on ones wish.

[dermotm]

Hi
Sorry Basari,

I probably wasn't too clear on what i did with the Audya. I didn't actually create any styles on it. I only edited some of them, e.g. instrument volumes etc, the same with the voices.
I think in general Ketron keyboards have a somewhat difficult method of programming styles but its like everything else, when you try it a few times it gets easier.
But it does pay off when you get it right.
One big plus that Ketron does have is the fact you can record a style via MIDI record.
I have created several styles for the XD9 this way and it gives the styles a more 'live' feels than actually playing individual samples on the keys.

I used a Roland V-Drums kit for the drum track, a Roland GK-2 guitar interface for rhythm guitar and guitar bits and it turns out very well.

Don't get me wrong i'm not putting Korg down in any shape or form, but i do think they could try and see what the could do with the style programming end of their arrangers re: instrument voicing/octaves considering how many users (just look at any of the arranger forums) end up looking for styles/help for their arrangers. Doesn't help though when it the manual isn't very concise either!!

Basari you are right though, the Audya has a long way to go and like the SD series we'll probably see more OS updates for a long time to come.
I just think too more manufacturers could do with looking at what Ketron has done and still do is to make a keyboard that sounds 'live' and not robotic.

[Sam CA]

I used a Roland V-Drums kit for the drum track, a Roland GK-2 guitar interface for rhythm guitar and guitar bits and it turns out very well.

I've done this with my PA 800. I haven't recorded them directly into the board itself, but there's no need to that. You can do this in any external sequencer, and then import the result into the keybaord.

I still think Audya users are coming short of saying why would someone want to pay that much money for this keyboard. Of course, they can always improve things and come up with new OS in the future, but that's not a very smart marketing technique for current customers at all. If i were to buy the keyboard , i would've wanted to see what it does right now.

[dermotm]

I agree with you mate, i do think though that spending nearly €4500 (in Ireland) on a keyboard is a bit silly. Granted the Audya has a lot going for it but its interface is very clunky and not well thought out.
But i have used this board and i am blown away by it. But spending that amount is crazy. I honestly can't see how Ketron can justify asking all that for it.

Crazy!