Needs input from M3 and PA2X users on which is better for me

[melka_ashur]

Thanks for the wealth of information. It clarified a lot of issues. I just had one question: when you said you record on your computer to get the cd-quality sound, do you mean you connect a mic straight into the comp, or some other accessory straight into the comp directly? Or are you still recording through the keyboard into the comp?

i have seen many demos but the quality is i think different when you see what ends up in the final product, and i haven't gotten to compare the oriental sounds on the M3, other than seeing a couple youtube videos; prior to that I didn't even know there were oriental sets available for the M3 and my only options were the pa800 or the pa2x.

Ive messed around on both in person, though admittently, pa2x are hard to find, and I only saw one that wasn't plugged into speakers at a guitar center, but since I have played on a pa800, i imagine it's similar but perhaps better quality and more options. i don't have a great deal of knowledge aout playing keyboards. I mostly play by ear, and use it as a tool to develop ideas, but I am mostly a vocaist. But i want a keyboard which can grow with my knowledge, and maybe if I can play my own instrumental tracks with it, and be a self sufficient artist one day, and not depend on another keyboardist, then its far better.

Also on demos and youtube videos its hard to know which keyboards being played on are stock and which have upgrades. It sounds like the M3 requires, or at least would be a better competitor after various boards have been added. I want to avoid having to add boards as much as possible, and leave the upgrades to upgrading the software with new sound sets, since that itself will take a great deal of research to see which oriental sets are most compplete and of the highest quality. There is awebsite called www.maqam.com which basically has severeal keyboards preloaded with a wide array of high quality sounds and styles, but too bad they don't have the pa2X. My friends who currently make my tracks use the pa series and have a lot of the available sounds, so no prob for the pa2x, the bigger task would be trying to find sets for the m3,. But yourcommentary on size of user bank, nd perhaps better quality of some sounds on the m3 is very important.

[melka_ashur]

Thanks for the wealth of information. It clarified a lot of issues. I just had one question: when you said you record on your computer to get the cd-quality sound, do you mean you connect a mic straight into the comp, or some other accessory straight into the comp directly? Or are you still recording through the keyboard into the comp?

i have seen many demos but the quality is i think different when you see what ends up in the final product, and i haven't gotten to compare the oriental sounds on the M3, other than seeing a couple youtube videos; prior to that I didn't even know there were oriental sets available for the M3 and my only options were the pa800 or the pa2x.

Ive messed around on both in person, though admittently, pa2x are hard to find, and I only saw one that wasn't plugged into speakers at a guitar center, but since I have played on a pa800, i imagine it's similar but perhaps better quality and more options. i don't have a great deal of knowledge aout playing keyboards. I mostly play by ear, and use it as a tool to develop ideas, but I am mostly a vocaist. But i want a keyboard which can grow with my knowledge, and maybe if I can play my own instrumental tracks with it, and be a self sufficient artist one day, and not depend on another keyboardist, then its far better.

Also on demos and youtube videos its hard to know which keyboards being played on are stock and which have upgrades. It sounds like the M3 requires, or at least would be a better competitor after various boards have been added. I want to avoid having to add boards as much as possible, and leave the upgrades to upgrading the software with new sound sets, since that itself will take a great deal of research to see which oriental sets are most compplete and of the highest quality. There is awebsite called www.maqam.com which basically has severeal keyboards preloaded with a wide array of high quality sounds and styles, but too bad they don't have the pa2X. My friends who currently make my tracks use the pa series and have a lot of the available sounds, so no prob for the pa2x, the bigger task would be trying to find sets for the m3,. But yourcommentary on size of user bank, nd perhaps better quality of some sounds on the m3 is very important.

[Rob Sherratt]

Thanks for the wealth of information. It clarified a lot of issues. I just had one question: when you said you record on your computer to get the cd-quality sound, do you mean you connect a mic straight into the comp, or some other accessory straight into the comp directly? Or are you still recording through the keyboard into the comp?

I record via digital SPD/IF to the computer using a little USB audio interface adapter which has optical SPD/IF TOSLINK interfaces, and which cost me $20 from Ebay. I also bought two optical TOSLINK cables which cost $3 each. I posted the details on another thread which youu will find if you search for TOSLINK.

i have seen many demos but the quality is i think different when you see what ends up in the final product, and i haven't gotten to compare the oriental sounds on the M3, other than seeing a couple youtube videos; prior to that I didn't even know there were oriental sets available for the M3 and my only options were the pa800 or the pa2x.

You originally asked for oriental styles, which are only available for the style-based Pa2x. Oriental sampled sounds (not styles) are available for the M3, and basaristudios and kidnepro have these available.

Ive messed around on both in person, though admittently, pa2x are hard to find, and I only saw one that wasn't plugged into speakers at a guitar center, but since I have played on a pa800, i imagine it's similar but perhaps better quality and more options. i don't have a great deal of knowledge aout playing keyboards. I mostly play by ear, and use it as a tool to develop ideas, but I am mostly a vocaist. But i want a keyboard which can grow with my knowledge, and maybe if I can play my own instrumental tracks with it, and be a self sufficient artist one day, and not depend on another keyboardist, then its far better.

Either the Pa2x and/or the M3 would help you develop. But from your description re vocals and playing by ear, I personally would recommmend the Pa2x in the first instance. It will be more spontaneous for you, the style based accompaniments will provide great backings while you play by eaar, there are many vocal facilities including the harmonizer built in, and you can quickly record to MP3 and listen back to your compositions and singing.

Also on demos and youtube videos its hard to know which keyboards being played on are stock and which have upgrades. It sounds like the M3 requires, or at least would be a better competitor after various boards have been added. I want to avoid having to add boards as much as possible, and leave the upgrades to upgrading the software with new sound sets, since that itself will take a great deal of research to see which oriental sets are most compplete and of the highest quality. There is awebsite called www.maqam.com which basically has severeal keyboards preloaded with a wide array of high quality sounds and styles, but too bad they don't have the pa2X. My friends who currently make my tracks use the pa series and have a lot of the available sounds, so no prob for the pa2x, the bigger task would be trying to find sets for the m3,. But your commentary on size of user bank, and perhaps better quality of some sounds on the m3 is very important

Since you have many friends with Pa keyboards who can make sounds and styles available to you, go with the Pa2x initially. Ultimately the M3 would enable you to make better records, but I think 2 to 3 years on the Pa2x first would put you in a better position with your composing skills.

The M3 is more complex, requires more work and skill, it costs more by the time you have invested in computer based recording gear, and it may set you back with your musical development initially, at least until you have mastered the technical complexity and cost of the M3 coupled with computer based recording software.

I hope I don't get flamed by other M3 owners for making this recommendation. I have both Pa2x and M3 and wouldn't be without either keyboard. But if I was forced to choose one of them on a budget, it would be the Pa2x. I am only making the same recommendation to you because your requirements are similar to my own. A different person with different requirements may well find the M3 to be a better choice. Certainly for someone who already has a recording studio, and who wants a top quality studio keyboard, and who is not constrained by the cost of hardware and software add-ons, the M3 would be the recommendation.

Best regards,
Rob

[melka_ashur]

thank you again, all your suggestions seem well reasoned and logical. Don't worry about getting bashed by m3 users, i'm sure they are both good, but since I only have enough money for one, and not a lot for extras, I think the pa2x would be a better choice.

[Lee]

Good choice!
And, you could always add a M3 MODULE later...like I am planning...then you have the best of both!

One (M3M) just went on e-bay for $800...I was not ready to buy...but it gives an idea on cost.
Lee

[a.schemkes]

Rob you don't get flamed at all, what a very good explanation of both keeyboards. Man you should sell those baby's, or at least get a percentage of the sales...

It was you that made me decide to buy an "arranger" PA2xPro. and never regretted a moment. I'm still playing it LIVE and just for fun at home.

It was the curiousity that made me buy the M3. What a possibilties and KARMA wow, that's a whole new world to explore.

After reading the posts I think he is best of buying a Pa2xPro, and like Lee said, buy a M3M on ebay if you got the money to spare.

[Sam CA]

I've been debating for a while to go for the keyboard or the module version of M3 for a while. I don't like to buy used electronics, so i'll end up paying the full price.

[Rob Sherratt]

I've been debating for a while to go for the keyboard or the module version of M3 for a while. I don't like to buy used electronics, so i'll end up paying the full price.

Hi Sam,

If you buy the M3M module version, you will not be able to buy a keybed from Korg later on, and there are very few keybeds available second hand. If you can afford it, the only way is to get the keybed now. The 88-note keybed is by far the best quality and I know that as a professional pianist, you prefer weighted keyboards. The 73-note keybed is not as nice to play as the 76-note keybed on the Pa2x. The M3-73 does have better aftertouch response than the Pa2x, but the key action feels more springy and less expressive. It's fine for an organist I guess.

Also it's essential in my opinion to get the $300 EXB-RADIAS and $99 EXB-M256 expansions at the time of purchase. The EXB-RADIAS gives the M3 the synth capabilities of a MOOG, and the EXB-M256 is essential to load the full 256 Mbytes of free sounds/ programs/ combis that Korg include with the M3. Without the EXB-M256, you will be forever shuffling sample sets because you can only load 64 Mbytes of samples in the standard RAM.

Whichever choice you make, contact Frank Ventresca at Audioworks CT for a quotation. He has been extremely helpful to me with several purchases, and his prices are very competitive. Email to: audioworks@snet.net

Best regards,
Rob