Improve Microkorg XL Piano?

[spybar]

Hi mates,

I'm pretty new to synthesis...

I'd be grateful for some tips about improving XL's Piano sound.

Or if you can, please share your Piano patch.

Thank you so much!

[xmlguy]

If you bought the MKXL to get a really good piano sound, you're probably going to remain disappointed. It only has a single mono PCM sample. Even $200 Casio and Yamaha romplers have stereo, multisamples for pianos. Many ROMplers not only have samples for each note, but sometimes different samples for multiple velocities.

[spybar]

Hi xmlguy, thanks for your reply!

I know MKXL wasn't designed to supply a wonderful piano...

I thought maybe there is a way to improve it a bit with some synthesis & make it, at least a little, more playable (I think the Wurly & Rhodes are playable).

I will appreciate any & every tip.

Thank you mates!

[xmlguy]

A lot really depends on what you mean by "improvement" and "playable". Can you identify the specific attributes that you like about the Whurly and Rhodes, besides their organ and EP sound. For example, there's probably thousands of variations of these keyboard sounds, put perhaps only a few of them that you might consider an improvement and playable, whereas someone else might only consider other varations to be playable. So if you can identify the specific audio attributes about the ones you like, then I and others here may be able to help you to create or modify the MKXL piano sound more to your liking.

[spybar]

So if you can identify the specific audio attributes about the ones you like, then I and others here may be able to help you to create or modify the MKXL piano sound more to your liking.

Dear xmlguy,
Thank you for your detailed reply!

I'm looking for a Classical Piano sound. As expressive & rich as it can be. I know the MKXL is pretty limited with its AC Piano capabilities... Yet, I think that its Rhodes & Wurly are much more expressive than its AC piano.

An example of piano type can be found in Ivo Pogorelich's Chopin Prelude Op 28 No. 4:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VIxx9luPRfw

I know the MKXL is limited, so I can't really compare the sound, but I'm sure it can be MORE expressive than the internal piano sound.

Since I'm not (yet) so good in synthesis, & I need a better piano sound for the coming rehearsals & shows - I'd be VERY grateful for help!

Thank you soo much!
I appreciate the help!

SpyBar

[xmlguy]

I think you'd be far better off buying a used Casio WK-110 for $120 than to trying to improve the MKXL patch to get a classical grand piano sound. The MKXL doesn't even have reverb. The Casio has 76 keys, has a large number of samples including grand piano, has effects, is lightweight, runs on batteries, and has speakers built-in. It also has a sequencer, can play midi tracks including general midi songs, and has drumkits with arranger styles and patterns.

If I was going to recommend a keyboard for grand piano, the MKXL would be near the bottom of the list, along with all the VA synths that weren't designed to do good acousic pianos. The Casio WK models wouldn't be at the top of the list, but they're much higher up that most VA synths, and the Casios are probably the best value other than a used real piano that someone gives you for free.

[spybar]

Hi mate,

Thanks for your reply.

Well, I have Roland Fantom G7 (wonderful(!) yet a lil' heavy), it's my main keyboard (with a very rich sounds palette & great live & studio capabilities) for studio & gigs. Recently I bought the lil' MKXL as a super duper ultra portable keyboard. So I'm trying to "tame" the lil' MKXL as much as I can.

I know it can't be a real grand piano, or even close to my Fantom G7... yet, I wish to make the most of its limited piano capabilities.

Again, I appreciate your patience, care & replies!

SpyBar

[xmlguy]

The thing is that the MKXL is very limited for the task of creating a good acoustic piano sound. Use your G7 or sample it for piano. There's lots of better super duper ultra portable keyboards for what you're trying to do. For example, you could tweek your G7 pianos exactly the way you want and then load the result on the MicroSampler for portability. That would be so much better than trying to synthesize an acoustic piano on the MKXL. The MKXL is great for VA synth sounds, not so good for acoustic emulations. The X50 is very portable for a 61 key, at it has a two way velocity switched stereo piano multi-sample.

Yes, I know you still want to make the MKXL piano sound better. Maybe someone else has some tips for ya.

[tpantano]

The thing is that the MKXL is very limited for the task of creating a good acoustic piano sound. Use your G7 or sample it for piano. There's lots of better super duper ultra portable keyboards for what you're trying to do. For example, you could tweek your G7 pianos exactly the way you want and then load the result on the MicroSampler for portability. That would be so much better than trying to synthesize an acoustic piano on the MKXL. The MKXL is great for VA synth sounds, not so good for acoustic emulations. The X50 is very portable for a 61 key, at it has a two way velocity switched stereo piano multi-sample.

Yes, I know you still want to make the MKXL piano sound better. Maybe someone else has some tips for ya.

Yes, the MicroSampler was what I was about to say, you can load samples from your G7 on there and have a keyboard pretty close to the size of the MKXL.

Also, you could get a MicroX or X50, but IMO, the piano samples aren't that great.

[Ghost301]

yes yes get this get that i think the man just wants a bit of an improvement over the given micro xl piano
im gonna try and walk you through this. what i did for the piano was take the ac piano program they gave you and change these settings
osc2: lvl=60\wave=sine\semitones = (+12)
filter1:cutoff = 74\resonance = 0\balance = 16\keytrack = 0.16\eg int =0
eg2:a=0\dt=83\sl=0\at=53\lv.velo = +63
some settings may already be set to the suggested values but i wasnt quite sure what i had changed and what was preset. if that doesnt help you just speak up and ill try again

[hirodotsu]

Thank you Ghost for answering the question. You have helped me out as well.

[CharlesFerraro]

yes yes get this get that i think the man just wants a bit of an improvement over the given micro xl piano

lol, seriously

Something I think would help a lot would be to try and increase the dynamic response of the pcm waveform. Too bad I don't have an XL to try this with but I'm familiar enough with the engine to try and give some exact values...

First thing, fashion the amp envelope to the likeness of the PCM A.Piano sample so the transient decay matches up. In fact, shave off a little of the sample's decay with EG2. Thats to say, make the volume drop out sooner than it would if you played the sample with full envelope sustain. So EG2 Sustain = Zero, Decay 55, and release 45. Put the Attack at like... 2

Now unfortunately the XL doesn't have level velocity controls in the envelopes so you're going to have to set that up in the V. Patch bay. Use patch 1 and set velocity to amp level. Increase the intensity to 48 or even up to 63, whatever you feel is a comfortable dynamic response on the keyboard. I also dropped Amp level down to 90 just cause.

Now why did we set the Amp envelope up the way we did? Heres where it gets fun. Use Velocity to control the contours of EG2. So use patches 2,3, and 4 to patch velocity into EG2 Decay, Release, and Attack. The Decay and Release patches should have positive intensity while the Attack patch has negative intensity. This is so when you hit the keys harder you will hear a longer sustain period and also a sharper attack.
So Decay Patch = 18 int Release patch = 8 Attack patch = -3

Okay So now lets set up the Filter Envelope (EG1) to control our brightness response. Set up EG1 like EG2. Drop your filter cutoff to 60. Put filter EG intensity on 26 and filter Velo Sensitivy on 26. Now the harder you play the brighter it should be. Add a pinch of Reso to bring out the highs of the filter sweep. Try a reso value of 20.

Finally, even though the XL doesn't have Reverb, try inserting an LCR Delay to give the sample some ambiance. Dry/Wet = 89:11 with High Dampening at 75%

I like Ghosts suggestion of keytracking the filter. try that out.

On a final note, everything I said is an approximation. I don't have an XL so I don't know exactly what this description would sound like. Should be pretty good but you may need to adjust things like the cutoff value or EG1 decay, also adding EQ etc.

[johnroney]

yeah... please UPLOAD your programming! !
i tried the 2nd osc sine wav. yeah, helps alot, but there is no difference at different velocities. normal?
please advise.
thanks..