Combi problem - sound break during the change of sounds

Audioslaved · Post by **Audioslaved** » Tue Feb 01, 2011 9:49 pm

Hello, I need some help regarding that combi problem. For example, the song I`m playing is very intensive and no pauses or breaks must be heard on that play. Furthermore, I need to change the sound in the middle of my play. Let`s say I`m holding some notes with my right hand. At the same time I`m touching the display with my left arm in order to change the sound. Unfortunately, I get the result of failed intensive play due to the sound break which happens immediatelly after touching the display. I need the same thing, as it works in prog mode, no sound break during the change of the sounds, just soft conversion to the selected sound - everything is fine here. How to get such a result in combi mode - are there any helpful sollutions? Maybe the sustain (damper) pedal could be the way to solve this problem? I just need to get my live performances going well, but it seems that combi mode is not proper enough for me. Maybe there are any other suggestions for playing live performances? Thank you for your replies.

Mr.Green · Post by **Mr.Green** » Wed Feb 02, 2011 8:03 pm

I hate to break it to you but the solution is to sell your M50 and buy the new Kronos.

No, really.

Trust me, I have been cursing at this too.

Having a second (or more) keyboard acting as a MIDI controller and then assigning programs to its MIDI channel in Combi mode helps but it only gets you so far.

When I bought my M50 it didn't even cross my mind that a modern keyboard wouldn't do this properly. My old Ensoniq ESQ-1, released in 1986, did that perfectly. Yeah... I kinda took a break between those two.

GeraldBart · Post by **GeraldBart** » Thu Feb 03, 2011 8:10 am

I have been cursing too.

Korg promoted the M50 as a keyboard suitable for live performances, stating that patches can be easily located. Since that is the case, smooth patch transition should have been one of its features. This is not breakthrough technology as it has been around for at least a decade.

Before the Kronos came along, I wonder if Korg engineers knew what live playing is all about.

Audioslaved · Post by **Audioslaved** » Thu Feb 03, 2011 2:33 pm

'When I bought my M50 it didn't even cross my mind that a modern keyboard wouldn't do this properly.' - I had absolutely the same thought. My old Yamaha PSR-530 did those transitions between sounds perfectly. This is something more than just unbelievable. The only way is to play live performances in prog mode or do it in combi without changing the sounds. As you have said, I must consider the possibility to sell that 'modern' keyboard.

Mr.Green · Post by **Mr.Green** » Thu Feb 03, 2011 5:36 pm

Even in Prog mode it's far from what I want. It holds the notes but it switches them to the new patch with an annoying "click" in the process.

Apparently you have to pay $3000 to get this revolutionary feature these days.

X-Trade · Post by **X-Trade** » Thu Feb 03, 2011 6:38 pm

The reason this happens is because of the effects structure.

In order to switch effectively between patches without any 'jump' or 'gap', you would effectively need twice the effects processing power just for those few seconds where you change, where you still have effects processing the previous sound, and new effects processing the new sound.

That's an awful waste of processing power, especially in a fixed architecture system like the M50.

Older synths didn't do this because they didn't have effects, or only had very limited effects sections.

This is related to the "programs don't retain their effects in a song/combi" situation 'problem'. Other manufacturers get around this by giving each program its own set of effects, but those have much more limited effects, again.

Korg's approach has a number of advantages and disadvantages, namely the above mentioned issues. The advantage is the effects programming potential - which makes Korg's instruments sound so great! A program can use the entire board's processing power for its effects if it wants to - all 5 IFX, 2 MFX, etc. Whereas in other manufacturer's systems a sound may be limited to one or two effects, perhaps only of a certain type such as flange/chorus and reverb/delay.

In Korg's new KRONOS this isn't necessary because the entire system runs on a general purpose programmable computer CPU (dual core atom), and the effects are just processing time, so it can reduce polyphony or whatever dynamically to allocate more power to the effects for a short while. The kind of processing architecture on the M50 and other workstations can't reprogram itself that quickly and dynamically.

Anyway, people have still been using M50s and M3s and even Tritons for 'seamless patch changing' for almost a decade. There are a number of workarounds. The one I choose to go for is to just avoid patch changes. I don't stay stuck on the same patch, but I do take full advantage of having two additional MIDI controllers, and split zones, etc. Zones and MIDI channels don't take up polyphony like layering and muting does either, but that is another option.

Furthermore (irrelevant here) KARMA on the M3 and KARMA Workstation keyboards offers a workaround whereby turning on KARMA passes through note data but to different channels so you can have two different sets of patches to play in the same combi.