Guitar Center has become a complete joke ...

[Vlad_77]

+1 For Sweetwater!

Jason Koontz is my contact there and is a real pro and a hell of a nice guy to deal with. As for GC, I think it is hit or miss. In my city, the GC has ONE pro keyboard in stock: a Yamaha XF-8. They are not stocking the Kronos OR the JP-80. Furthermore none of the guys working there play keys. They WILL deal on sound equipment but they refuse to deal on keys.

I have to give a nod also to Sam Ash: big chain but really cool people. I never get the sense from Sweetwater or Sam Ash that their employees are under some sort of gun to meet quotas. Jason at Sweetwater has the patience of a saint and the people at Sam Ash patiently answered a TON of questions I had about Kronos. At GC, all I get is, "well, no one here plays keys, sorry." Well GC, you could have sold me a Kronos if you would have done your homework.

Ahimsa,
Vlad

[dregsor]

GC needs to get a clue. To me, it all comes down to customer service, which they lack.

+1

Already placed an order from SW for accessories I need IF the Kronos ever arrives from GC. I leaned heavily toward changing the GC Kronos order over to them. Since I'm now at the top of the GC list, and since they both expect units in early September, I'll give it a few more weeks.

I really look forward to soon being able to talk about Kronos functionality and programming instead of all this other crap.

[Zeroesque]

Comparing Sweetwater and GC is difficult, especially on the salesperson side of things which people are calling customer service here.

Sweetwater reps get paid twice as much as an average GC or Sam Ash sales guy (especially in technology departments like keys). They are paid that way because they are expected to have far more education and/or experience in music tech, demonstrate a relatively higher level of professionalism, and they have to move to Ft. Wayne, Indiana. Most of their day is spent on the computer and the phone, and usually the customer only interfaces with this one person. Manufacturer reps can easily educate the entire sales staff by visiting just this one location.

Contrast this against GC: it is closer to a Best Buy type of retail model, where you don't need everyone to be a superstar expert because the tough questions can be fielded by one department manager, and the other guys can simply know how to find the gear on the floor, stockroom and the computer and then ring people up after the customer has usually seen and touched the stuff they will buy. Notice this last bit of difference: you can usually play the gear that you will buy. Obviously that is a gigantic advantage over buying online, on the phone or through mail-order. Also, manufacturer reps have to visit hundreds of stores to educate the entire sales staff.

Ask yourself if you think GC could make money paying top dollar for all of their sales associates in all of those stores...or if Sweetwater could make money by hiring check-out people.

I'm guessing that a lot of people on this forum use both sales models to their advantage from time to time.

I hope I'm not offending anyone w/ this post, as it is, of course, somewhat of a generalization.

[Vlad_77]

Good points Zeroesque but GC's compenation structure has been described as draconian at best by many employees - including ones who still work there. It seems to me that Sweetwater is making money and further more I know that when I call there, if Jason is not in, I am always referred to an associate who can answer questions. I have had the same positive experience with Sam Ash and Sam Ash as you correctly state is closer to a GC type merchant than Sweetwater.

I think it does come down to a store to store experience with regard to GC. Many on here and elsewhere have had positive experiences with GC. Maybe it's just the GC in my city that sucks.

Ahimsa,
Vlad

[Mystic38]

If i say "Jupiter 80" will this thread go where it should be?.. as in "off topic"

[sansei]

I stopped by and was told by my local GC (Modesto, CA) last week that they don't have any Kronos' in stock, they don't plan on having any and that I would not be able to special order one from them.

Of course, I realize I was speaking with a "regular" salesperson and not a manager, but I still didn't expect that kind of blanket response.

Then again, a few years ago, I was in there auditioning an OASYS to actually purchase and a salesman walked up to the amp it was connected to and without saying a word, turned the amp almost all the way down. They lost the $8k sale and another retailer got it.

[pleiades7]

I have been going through the same with Musician Friend. Paid in early May for an 88. Have felt totally jerked around. Not the stores, it's Korg. I can deal with a straight answer, but being given ever shifting goal post dates is beyond frustrating.

[GregC]

I have been going through the same with Musician Friend. Paid in early May for an 88. Have felt totally jerked around. Not the stores, it's Korg. I can deal with a straight answer, but being given ever shifting goal post dates is beyond frustrating.

I said that in the beginning to the OP, its Korg.

I put $ down in Feb for an '88. Still waiting.

I just heard that Korg raised the MAP here in the US on the 88.

Gotta love capitalism.

[nitecrawler]

I'm guessing that a lot of people on this forum use both sales models to their advantage from time to time.

I hope I'm not offending anyone w/ this post, as it is, of course, somewhat of a generalization.

Spot on! My experience exactly. Both have their advantages.

[WorknMan]

Notice this last bit of difference: you can usually play the gear that you will buy. Obviously that is a gigantic advantage over buying online, on the phone or through mail-order.

Although this is true, you can't actually hear what you play most of the time, because of the absolute chaos in these stores. Even if you have headphones, that doesn't help much when the other people playing in the same room don't have headphones, and they're blasting the volume to try to play over each other. And that doesn't even include the 5yos who are banging on the keys, or the GC reps screaming into the intercom about every 2 minutes, trying to get each other's attention.

As far as I know though, there aren't really any better alternatives. I actually thought about buying some gear and setting up my own little 'showroom' in my living room with headphones on each synth, and then charging locals an hourly fee to come in and demo the instruments. And I'm talking about real gear, and not the 90% microKorg-type cheap crap and mid-range boards that GC carries.

[GregC]

Notice this last bit of difference: you can usually play the gear that you will buy. Obviously that is a gigantic advantage over buying online, on the phone or through mail-order.

Although this is true, you can't actually hear what you play most of the time, because of the absolute chaos in these stores. Even if you have headphones, that doesn't help much when the other people playing in the same room don't have headphones, and they're blasting the volume to try to play over each other. And that doesn't even include the 5yos who are banging on the keys, or the GC reps screaming into the intercom about every 2 minutes, trying to get each other's attention.

As far as I know though, there aren't really any better alternatives. I actually thought about buying some gear and setting up my own little 'showroom' in my living room with headphones on each synth, and then charging locals an hourly fee to come in and demo the instruments. And I'm talking about real gear, and not the 90% microKorg-type cheap crap and mid-range boards that GC carries.

you are 100% correct about the GC chaos. Also brilliant to have the drum room next to the keyboard room.

The only chance for a decent demo is to hit the GC at 10:00 am. Then most
of the gear is in disarray from the last evening so one has to factory reset
the keyboards . And you have to bring your fav headphones.

All in all, its not worth the hassle, IMO

[dregsor]

The only chance for a decent demo is to hit the GC at 10:00 am

+1

That's what I did. But also did it on a weekday. I had two uninterrupted hours using my best studio monitor headphones.

[WorknMan]

you are 100% correct about the GC chaos. Also brilliant to have the drum room next to the keyboard room.

At my local GC, the keyboard and drum machines are both in the same room When I went to demo the Kronos, I actually disconnected all the cables from the drum machines before I started. I'm not sure if any of the employees saw me and/or if it pissed them off, but I really didn't care.

And to add to the misery of the whole experience, most of the boards don't have pedals, some aren't turned on, and if you actually wanted to play thru the speakers, a lot of the synths are only connected to one speaker, so you get mono sound. When I was trying the Kronos, they had a Motif XS7 (used) set up as such that it was completely in the way of the upper notes of the Kronos.

My guess is that the reps who work in these stores don't work on commission and/or are not interested at all in selling gear. Would love for anybody who works at GC to post to this thread and tell us why these stores are such a clusterf**k.

[ScottB601]

First, and you probably already know this, but "In 2000, Guitar Center purchased mail order and Internet retail house Musician's Friend for $50 million, asserting that the merged company was the world's largest seller of musical instruments. Musician's Friend became a wholly owned subsidiary headquartered in Medford, Oregon."

Second, my local GC in Aurora, IL has been fantastic. Hearty discounts and great service. Very responsive to my needs and sometimes bends over backwards to make me happy and get my money.

Thirdly, my experience with Sweetwater has been outstanding as well. My sales guy (one Mr. Nick Church) is willing to talk price reductions whenever possible, shipping is very fast, and returns are reasonable and easy as well.

[dregsor]

I'm expecting my 73 to ship this week, 12th to the 15th. That's the word I got from GC about a week ago. I'm hoping to post something positive in this thread soon.

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