problem with ns5r need help

keysonfire · Post by **keysonfire** » Thu Jun 21, 2012 1:55 am

Im hoping someone can help! I have a ns5r sound module that I let someone borrow and I got it back and now when i play it with certain patches a random note stay ringing even when I take my foot off sustain pedal and not playing any keys. Ive tried changing keyboards but still same issue. Please someone help the damn korg support sucks and the manual for this unit is useless...

T3owner · Post by **T3owner** » Thu Jun 21, 2012 3:03 am

Perhaps try a factory reset. See:
http://www.techno-id.com/korg_initialize.htm

billbaker · Post by **billbaker** » Thu Jun 21, 2012 4:56 am

I'll bet you a nickel that the hang-up doesn't happen until you plug in and press the sustain pedal at least once.

Can you make a note hang without using the sustain pedal? Does pumping your sustain pedal once and holding it down (while not playing) make it stop?

Check the polarity of the sustain control in the global settings - whatever it is now try using the opposite setting.

or

Make sure you haven't accidentally changed the polarity of your sustain pedal (if it has a switch to do it). That can easily happen by accident and be un-noticed until this problem pops up.

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Welcome to the forum.

BB

keysonfire · Post by **keysonfire** » Thu Jun 21, 2012 9:25 pm

No its not the sustain pedal im able to play chords with sustain pedal and I let sustain pedal go and the chord dissappears but 1 random note will stay ringing in the background. Korg said its some kind of feedback whatever that means.

keysonfire · Post by **keysonfire** » Thu Jun 21, 2012 9:27 pm

Ive done the reset deal multiple times and doesnt fix it. Its driving me insane!!!

keysonfire · Post by **keysonfire** » Thu Jun 21, 2012 10:07 pm

I also just found out it only happens on prog sounds and comb sounds! doesnt do that garbage on GM sounds... Go figure its gotta be some kind of setting! I just cant find it..

billbaker · Post by **billbaker** » Fri Jun 22, 2012 12:31 am

keysonfire,

You are not alone in being occasionally frustrated cross-eyed by your gear. That is why there is a forum and why I take the time to do what I can here. I never know when I'll need help, too.

OK, some questions. They may help you troubleshoot further.

Does the sustained note stay the same (like always C) or does it change?

Does it start on a particular voice of polyphony - i.e., does the 7th simultaneous note hang? There are 32 small LCD indicators along the bottom of the display that may show you where the hang is occurring. Is it consistent?

Is it always in the same octave range or is it sometimes high or low?

Always within the held chord or truly random note?

Does it always hang after using the sustain pedal, never by itself spontaneously, like after a really big chord?

Is it the same program or program within a combi that hangs - i.e., only the piano voice within a combi - or is it happening on multiple voices?

GM voices typically use only one oscillator, which could account for their apparent immunity. Can you tell if all the voices that hang are always 2 osc, and if they are, do both voices hang - i.e., is only osc 2 hanging on?

Is there any common thread of FX being used - i.e., only hanging when Reverb is programmed? Reverb is set at the channel level. There's a part level indicator that may tell you which part is till sounding. Make sure that the reverb level is not at 99 (aka "a feedback issue") on that part.

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Memory protection off when you do full resets?

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The commonest cause of hung notes, after a polarity issue with sustain (btw: sorry that wasn't it, I owe you a nickel), is not getting a note-off midi message. PG-39 of manual under "trouble shooting" warns against disconnecting cable - that it can cause hung notes exactly as you describe.

Have you tried a different midi cable? No obvious cable damage or bent pins in the one you're using now? The MIDI IN jack is not cracked or damaged? You are plugged to IN and not THRU? You haven't got anything else (i.e., "Host") plugged in that might be sending a conflicting message?

There's a "midi being received" light or indicator on the front - during a note hang are you seeing midi being received?

Again, you may be able to tell which "part" is still sounding from the front panel indicator - if it is the same each time concentrate on the signal path for that part.

I think it says in the manual that the NS5R is 8 part multi-timbral - any chance you're sending something on channels 9-16 from your keyboard? Control messages, including sustain, come from or through your keyboard - has anything changed on your controlling board?

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Have you asked your friend whether he experienced the same problems when he borrowed it and what exactly he might have messed with in the unit in getting it to work for himself?

BB

keysonfire · Post by **keysonfire** » Fri Jun 22, 2012 2:20 am

ok let me start the hanging note are part of a BIG chord. sometime high or low and if i set the bank in GM it doesnt happen. When i put it in prog banks its the worst then less worst in comb. Its not the cable or the plugs are visibly great and again it happens only in prog or comb mode. So i dont think its connection problem. Now when the note stays ringing the midi receive light is not on. Is there any way I could reset all of this module to factory settings? ive tried the initialization with memory protect off but still the same. I think when he used it with pc with host port maybe he changed a midi setting... I dont know and its killing me! I have to play in a few days with this and im up the creek! But I truly appreciate your help... another thing is i can make it do it with out big chord or sustain pedal just a single note and it almost feels like the sustain is on just that note but the pedal isnt pressed and no midi signal when it happens

billbaker · Post by **billbaker** » Fri Jun 22, 2012 3:17 am

The reset routine T3 sent should have put it back to "factory". Is that Utility Mode function Preset/Initialize (parameter 53 - manual pg 76)? I asked about protect because if you do the routine but protect is on it won't work.

You're using a controller and therefore a cable, but if the cable checks out OK then we can eliminate it from the list - I'd still suggest a different/new cable because sometimes damage is not obvious.

No hung notes in GM, no hung notes in multi-timbral.

That it happens with big chords and double osc and sustain may be a clue. There's a phenomenon called "voice robbing" where big chords (particularly those encountered when you use sustain) can cause the voice count (polyphony) to be exceeded. When that happens - big chords + sustain or very complex MIDI sequences - the engine "robs" oscillators or notes from the sustained portion so that the next notes can be heard. This happens automatically, and when it does a note-off is supposed to be sent, but if it isn't you'd get a hung note. (see pg 34 of manual)

Were you able to determine if the hung note was the same part each time? The combi should be all the same midi channel unless you are doing a split from your keyboard and playing in multi mode. I could see where if a voice got a note on on channel 2 and was robbed to play a voice on channel 1 that a note-off message might be sent to the wrong part - but that's a pretty buggy assumption on my part - it shouldn't happen that way.

You aren't controlling more than one module or using MIDI THRU to drive the NS5R? In Utility Mode make sure all the voices are set to "A" - internal control - change any "B" to "A", and make sure there are no C voices (external).

Parameter 50 of Utility: RX Switch should all be on (default setting).

In Part Edit Mode/Parameter 20: EG Release Time, it is possible to over-ride the release parameter of a program (or program within a combi) such that it goes longer (perhaps infinitely) than the original program - make sure all parts are "00" or program default.

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I tried to look for ways that the amp/sustain level could be screwed with in non-obvious ways. Let me know if I hit it.

BB

keysonfire · Post by **keysonfire** » Fri Jun 22, 2012 3:57 am

All the settings you sent me were all right
. I think I'm just gonna call it junk and use as paperweight! It's a shame because I love this module! It gives me the biggest variety of sounds. If u can come up with something else I would appreciate it.

keysonfire · Post by **keysonfire** » Fri Jun 22, 2012 3:58 am

Btw I'm only using module by itself
We might be on to something with the double osc deal I think. Because when the note hangs up I can find the note and continue hitting it and after 2or3 times it does it again ..

billbaker · Post by **billbaker** » Fri Jun 22, 2012 4:24 am

You are using with a keyboard, no? What keyboard?

Was your buddy using it with a computer, and if so using what program?

BB

T3owner · Post by **T3owner** » Fri Jun 22, 2012 10:25 am

keysonfire wrote:Btw I'm only using module by itself [...]

Please tell us what MIDI connections you've made to the module. Besides MIDI-In, do you have MIDI-Thru or MIDI-Out connected to anything?

keysonfire · Post by **keysonfire** » Fri Jun 22, 2012 5:31 pm

midi in on module thats it. Im using a keyboard. korg X3 i also tried it with my yamaha cs1x and yamaha ex5 all the same exact problem.

hazabikit · Post by **hazabikit** » Fri Jun 22, 2012 8:43 pm

I'd recommend you go buy a new cable and swap the old one out.
Cable problems are almost never visible.

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