MONO LEGATO BUG STILL THERE IN 2.02

[ak]

I am using PolyAfterTouch via the Midi_In port of the Kronos to detune it in real time.

Steps to make a program respond to PolyAfterTouch:

1. Select Pitch for OSC 1 or 2
2. In the Pitch area assign AMS to Poly After
3. Intensity to -00.50 (cents)
4. Enable Mono-Legato for this program.

Note: if Mono is Enabled then it will work, but if you select Mono-Legato then to it will cancel the pitch

am I clear now?

[fResH_]

FIX THIS KORG please

[asafar]

I have been wanting for a while to buy the Kronos but been waiting for this problem to be solved and this keyboard is not useful on stage without the full support for 1/4 tone switching on the fly.
Lots of people take my advice and i'm keeping them away from the Kronos until this Mono-Legato problem gets solved.

[youni]

please korg we are waiting we can't use this synth if you dont fix this problem of legato mono with 1/4 tone please i have kronos 5 months ago and i didnt take it in stage please....

[youni]

the kronos price is dropping the most musicians sell it why ?
- because they want a keybaord without a bugs, and this mono legato bug it's a big problem for us, we can't use properly the scales arabic if they dont fix it

[ak]

This topic is related to mono-legato and it has nothing to do with the sales of the Kronos

[youni]

we are waiting

[Andy Leary]

Karim helped me to understand how the AK-2 is using poly AT to modify the tuning. This use case is very specific, and it's also very important to some of our users. We will look into it and see if we can get this in to a future OS update. Thanks for being patient.

In the mean time, I came up with a work around that you can use for the AL-1 and STR-1 models. Since the Pitch Common LFO appears to work with the correct behavior, just use that to do the pitch modulation via Poly AT. To do that, set the LFO to a square waveform and set it to STOP which will give you a constant value. This is a nice little trick to use!

1) Set LFO 1 to waveform = Square and check STOP. This will put out a constant value of 1.0
2) Set Pitch Common LFO LFO Select to LFO1. Intensity to 0.0, Intensity AMS to Poly AT and Intensity to -50 cents, or -0.50. When Poly AT is full on (127) the pitch value will be -0.50 and otherwise, the pitch will be it's normal value.

This trick won't work for HD-1 since there is no common pitch mod. But, it DOES work for AL-1 and for STR-1. Also, MOD-7 can also handle poly AT to pitch directly (and work with mono legato) using Pitch AMS in the Osc Main page. MS-20 can handle poly AT to pitch directly and work with mono legato, but you can only use it for OSC 2, I think.

Also, I should point out that regular Mono (with Legato off) is working correctly and poly works correctly as well. This is only an issue with using Poly AT with Mono Legato mode.

[Andy Leary]

Here's another hack you can use to play PCM multisamples in Mono Legato mode with Poly AT to Pitch Mod *without* using the HD-1. Use the PCM Osc of the MOD-7.

1) From an Init voice MOD-7 program, connect the output of the PCM OSC to Output Mixer 1.
2) On the PCM Osc page, select the PCM multisample you want to use.
3) Set LFO 1 to waveform = Square and check STOP. This will put out a constant value of 1.0
4) On the Osc Main page, set Pitch LFO LFO Select to LFO1, Intensity to 0.00, Pitch LFO Intensity Modulation AMS to Poly After Touch and Intensity to -0.50. When Poly AT is full on (127) the pitch value will be -0.50 and otherwise, the pitch will be it's normal value.

Of course, you can now route that output of the PCM Osc into a filter (or even a waveshaper) as you like. The MOD-7 voice is more expensive than the HD-1, but if it's only for a lead sound then OK. Also, the MOD7 PCM Osc is mono only. Still, this might be a way to get your sounds playing until there is an OS update for the HD-1.

Hope that helps, or at least gives you guys some good ideas!!

[ak]

Andy,

This is a great news for Krog Kronos users. All we need is a solution for HD sounds with samples.

In the past and up to Korg Extreme, I used to send a full system dump to detune notes by using Global Scales User 0 and assign Scale User 0 to each Program and Combi. It was the most effective way, and almost no latency when transmitting the System Exclusive Data. However, Kronos Global System Dump takes a long time to process the data via the Midi In port and it is not a logical solution to use this method.

I recommend few solutions to Korg R&D.

1. Create a System Dump for Scales only. Implement a menu in Global to Send <> Receive User Scales. Options A. All Scales B. User Scale (x)

2. Implement a support for Real Time System Exclusive Message. For example, in the Korg Pa series, you send a msg and there is no interruption while playing a performance. <Real>

3. By using PolyAfterTouch, it is a good alternative solution to 1&2, but it requires a lot of programming per sound. Or we need a script to process the PCG and add PolyAfterTouch per sound.

For now, we know that Korg R&D is aware of this issue and are working on fixing the problem. Many thanks to you.

Best
KELFAR

[EXer]

What I've noticed so far is that with Poly Aftertouch and Mono Legato, most modulation uses the value from the initial note throughout the legato phrase. I understand that this doesn't work for your application, which assumes that the value will be updated per note even during a legato phrase. I can see logical arguments for working either way.

So, if I understand correctly, this is not a bug, and if Korg changed the behavior of Poly Aftertouch in Mono Legato mode that would meet oriental users' specific requirements, but it would result in a loss for other users or other applications.

Isn't the ak box already a workaround for synths that don't allow for alternate tunings?

Shouldn't that specific issue be solved by using the K's user scales rather than modifying the existing behavior of the poly AT?

[ak]

In theory, it should be fine if the behavior of the PolyAfterTouch and Mono-Legato have been fixed by Korg.

Let us wait for Korg R&D to give us a good common solution for PolyAfterTouch/Mono-Legato.

[danatkorg]

What I've noticed so far is that with Poly Aftertouch and Mono Legato, most modulation uses the value from the initial note throughout the legato phrase. I understand that this doesn't work for your application, which assumes that the value will be updated per note even during a legato phrase. I can see logical arguments for working either way.

So, if I understand correctly, this is not a bug, and if Korg changed the behavior of Poly Aftertouch in Mono Legato mode that would meet oriental users' specific requirements, but it would result in a loss for other users or other applications.

Isn't the ak box already a workaround for synths that don't allow for alternate tunings?

Shouldn't that specific issue be solved by using the K's user scales rather than modifying the existing behavior of the poly AT?

The AK box facilitates changing tuning on the fly, so that - for instance - "A" might play at 00 cents deviation at one point in a melody, and +50 cents deviation a few notes later in the same melody. Additional programming is also necessary for each individual Program, so that it responds to the poly aftertouch signals in the desired way.

That quote from me was from earlier in the discussion, I believe. I filed a bug report about this some time ago.

- Dan

[ak]

Thanks Dan!

[youni]

thanks korg for your support