Korg, please fix the responsiveness of the damn touch screen

SeedyLee · Post by **SeedyLee** » Sat Dec 22, 2012 4:30 am

I am so frustrated with the damn touch screen on the Kronos, I find myself not wanting to spend long period of time editing sounds, or walkng away in sheer frustration after trying to select UI elements after repeatedly jabbing at the screen.

What's really frustrating though is that it could be so easily fixed in software.

Korg could greatly improve the usability of the instrument by making a few simple changes:
1) Modify the UI so that UI elements do not need to be touched precisely - rather, when the screen is touched, select the closest UI element within a certain tolerance.

2) For pop-up lists, the arrow next to the text is sometimes extremely difficult to touch. In these cases, if the item is already selected, touching it again should show the list. If a suer is jabbing at the same control repeatedly, there's probably a good reason they're doing so, and simply beeping and doing nothing else is just plain stupid.

3) in item lists, if the user touches the currently selected item more than once, the software should assume that the user is obviously trying to change the value and select the nearest unselected item.

4) For the sake of my sanity, make the font in the (otherwise excellent) online help system larger, so it's actually possible to select hyperlinks with some sort of sense of purpose.

For all those considering purchasing a Kronos, I would strongly suggest you spend a good ten minutes playing with the touchscreen - selecting things, making changes to parameters etc, to see how you find it. It didn't bother me to begin with, but I'm becoming increasingly frustrated by the lack of responsiveness!

GregC · Post by **GregC** » Sat Dec 22, 2012 5:28 am

Stylus

Ojustaboo · Post by **Ojustaboo** » Sat Dec 22, 2012 5:49 am

Stylus might be fine if spending time editing a sound but in my opinion is impractible if just wanting to select or change one thing,

Or to put it another way, your playing away, rather than a quick press, you are adding a step where you have to pick up the stylus.

Might as well keep the editor fired up and grab the mouse instead.

Touchscreen hasn't really been an issue for me so far, I do sometimes have to press a couple of times to select the little arrows.

SeedyLee · Post by **SeedyLee** » Sat Dec 22, 2012 5:58 am

GregC wrote:Stylus

Stylus is a pragmatic solution, but one has to wonder why Korg didn't include such a vital tool in the box. Perhaps it's because it wouldn't look real good including circa-1993 technology with a flagship synthesizer!

If a stylus is the way to go, you may need to change your signature to "When you think about it, it's all you really need (plus stylus, not included)" :p

Rather than expecting thousands of Kronos users to mitigate the poor responsiveness through use of a stylus or the editor, perhaps Korg could just fix the problem as best as possible through software? In fact, Korg could charge $5 for an updated software version with these improvements, allowing each user to spend the $5 on the software instead of buying a stylus, and probably cover the cost of the development!

Just to clarify, most of the UI elements work okay most of the time. the two elements I have the most trouble with are the list boxes (tiny arrows, as well as densely populated items in the lists themselves) and the links in help. Set list works fine, as do the page tabs.

GregC · Post by **GregC** » Sat Dec 22, 2012 6:08 am

SeedyLee wrote:
GregC wrote:Stylus
Stylus is a pragmatic solution, but one has to wonder why Korg didn't include such a vital tool in the box. Perhaps it's because it wouldn't look real good including circa-1993 technology with a flagship synthesizer!

If a stylus is the way to go, you may need to change your signature to "When you think about it, it's all you really need (plus stylus, not included)" :p
Rather than expecting thousands of Kronos users to mitigate the poor responsiveness through use of a stylus or the editor, perhaps Korg could just fix the problem as best as possible through software? In fact, Korg could charge $5 for an updated software version with these improvements, allowing each user to spend the $5 on the software instead of buying a stylus, and probably cover the cost of the development!
Just to clarify, most of the UI elements work okay most of the time. the two elements I have the most trouble with are the list boxes (tiny arrows, as well as densely populated items in the lists themselves) and the links in help. Set list works fine, as do the page tabs.

What about using the arrow keys ?

SeedyLee · Post by **SeedyLee** » Sat Dec 22, 2012 6:09 am

Which arrow keys?

Edit: If you mean the up/dowm value keys above the value slider, ye they work well for selecting values and I do make considerable use of them. But it still leaves the issue of selecting the UI element you want.

Another solution to the problem would be to allow holding enter and suing the value slider/up-down keys or data wheel to change the selected UI element.

neomad · Post by **neomad** » Sat Dec 22, 2012 8:11 am

Stylus do not modify screen response.

I'm using a Nintendo DS (from my little son) stylus and works well, but response still 'plastic' and unacuratte. Moreover: you need to take away your hands from keyboard, then take a stylus, edit, leave stylus, etc etc. Ergonomy is affected.

I've tested Krome touchview screen and it's simply quicker and reacts quite well.

For sure this can be adressed by software: Krome works well. And same Kronos touchscreen (same brand) can be found in France at supermarkets checkout points: I was surprised how quick was the girl entering products !

EvilDragon · Post by **EvilDragon** » Sat Dec 22, 2012 8:25 am

It's time Korg started using capacitive instead of resistive touchscreens.

SKung · Post by **SKung** » Sat Dec 22, 2012 9:02 am

Unfortunately there still are no non-glossy capacitive displays on the market.

On a stage it is likely that sunlight or a spotlight shines on the screen and with a capacitive display you see sh*t.

That's why resistive display are used on keyboards (and I hope that the manufacturers don't switch to capacitive displays)

neomad · Post by **neomad** » Sat Dec 22, 2012 10:17 am

SKung wrote:Unfortunately there still are no non-glossy capacitive displays on the market.

On a stage it is likely that sunlight or a spotlight shines on the screen and with a capacitive display you see sh*t.

That's why resistive display are used on keyboards (and I hope that the manufacturers don't switch to capacitive displays)

Sorry, I can not agree. Even in many 'daylight' gigs I still can not read screen. But I'm old, I've started when synths did not have screens, so should not be a problem.

Capacitive displays will be integrated into a near future everywhere, I guess. If not, a mix of resistive screens or e-ink (as kindle) will do the job perfectly but yet slower than actual screen.

Coming back to current Kronos screen, resolution is great. But 'touch' function is not fully used (sequencer, sliders and knobs that can not be moved).

Cheers

EvilDragon · Post by **EvilDragon** » Sat Dec 22, 2012 10:51 am

SKung wrote:That's why resistive display are used on keyboards (and I hope that the manufacturers don't switch to capacitive displays)

No, they are used because they are cheaper. Capacitives are much better in just about everything, and they're a logical advancement even in keyboards. It must and it will happen.

Saxifraga · Post by **Saxifraga** » Sat Dec 22, 2012 11:03 am

This Kronos OS is from 90ties. lol
It´s so old style it boggles the mind.

No wonder people want products like Moog Voyager and retro style controllers with many knobs and pads.

To add something productive:

I used a Nintendo DS stick from day one, because of the problems others mentioned here.

What I also miss is the enter button working while inside a LOV (List of values). I have to hit the screen to get the value entered after selection.
If one could navigate the parameter pages old style with TAB, up/down arrows, value knob, slider and enter, it would work much more efficient.
The problem is that the OS designers did not implement one of the two paradigms correctly. It´s not fish nor flesh. It´s not enough to use a big touchscreen and use an OS from the 90ties.

But in the end the sound counts and I think it sounds fantastic. If I put a device with massive noise through my Kronos, like the OP-1, it get´s all filtered out without making the sound quality worse. Wow!

Fred x · Post by **Fred x** » Sat Dec 22, 2012 11:11 am

Hi Guys

A long time ago I went to a Korg Demonstration sponsored by my local Music Shop, after the standard demo's I had a try myself. I had exactly the problems that you describe and mentioned it to the demonstrator.

He gave me a simple tip that has worked well for me - Instead of using the finger tip simply use the back of the Nail, A bit like a sharp flick.

It might sound stupid but believe me it work well when you get used to it.

Fred

cobi · Post by **cobi** » Sat Dec 22, 2012 11:12 am

I also use a stylus (one with a big soft point) when dealing with more complex things. But I agree that the touch-screen handling is not state of the art.
Would be nice if Korg would improve that in the future.

cobi

Corgy · Post by **Corgy** » Sat Dec 22, 2012 12:25 pm

GregC wrote:Stylus

The first thing I did was getting a stylus - after few days of Kronos GUI experience. But pointing with the stylus and working on the value slider or wheel isn't that efficient.

So the second thing I did was to set up the hardware knobs and sliders to operate on the synth-parameters. Now I can make changes on parameters without the tedious switching between the GUI tabs - at least for some of them and I change the settings from session to session according to my needs.