virus and triton stabs in kronos

SanderXpander · Post by **SanderXpander** » Mon Sep 23, 2013 1:43 pm

Fair enough, looking forward go it. I'm quite sure, if you like synth based music, that the Kronos will ultimately blow your LE out of the water

I still own a Triton Extreme with MOSS by the way, and even then I was super happy with the upgrade in synth sounds.

Corgy · Post by **Corgy** » Mon Sep 23, 2013 2:03 pm

anticipation wrote: ...
2- The sounds of the Kronos sounds SUPERCLEAN to me. Although I put distortion or other stuff to give it richness and harmonics or eetc... I hear and feel like there is a transparent wall between my ears and the sound... It doesn't hit my face
...

Let me ask you a question for getting a better understanding.

Have you ever checked out Kronos-sounds like:

1) Prg I-A-107; "Stradivarious Sync" (based on AL-1); modulation by joysticks and velocity
Is this "clean" to your ears?

2) Prg U-E-019; "Spacious Pad" (based on Polysix); try some low basses also, very analogue and warm
Is this too "digital" to you?

3) There is a well-known Kronos-sound from Jordan Rudess called the "snarling pig", I think, he made it with HD-1.
Should be quite dirty and aggressive.

SanderXpander · Post by **SanderXpander** » Mon Sep 23, 2013 3:48 pm

And, again, the Trance Anthem Pad is great especially if you give it a shorter attack.

Also, generally speaking, many people claim older machines have a certain "warmth" that's lacking in the newer machines. I'm not talking about analog vs digital necessarily, but this discussion has been going on between the T series and the Trinity, the Trinity and the Triton, Triton and M3, and now Kronos. In my opinion, this has to do somewhat with the "low-fi" quality of the samples, filters and fx. Sounds are less bright and precise, which also allows them to sit louder in a mix.
With your background, even without editing the sounds themselves overly much, you should be able to get lots closer to what you want just using compressors, preamps, eq, etc, whether on board the Kronos or using external gear.

Corgy · Post by **Corgy** » Mon Sep 23, 2013 4:36 pm

SanderXpander wrote:...Also, generally speaking, many people claim older machines have a certain "warmth" that's lacking in the newer machines.

Some time ago I compared waveforms of vintage synths with up-to-date instruments - just out of curiosity. The waveforms of vintage saw-tooths or square-waves had a much smoother shape than a precise mathematical representation. The slopes of the shapes were relativly flat and had little wobbles at maximum and minimum.

Such waveforms should allways generate a smoother sound than a waveform with sharp vertical slopes. AFAIK the old analogue synths could only generate those smooth shapes - and depending on their different electronic circuits different brands like Moog, Korg, Roland etc. sounded different. Could this be the reason of getting more brightness with faster modern circuits or DSP?

SanderXpander wrote: In my opinion, this has to do somewhat with the "low-fi" quality of the samples, filters and fx. Sounds are less bright and precise, which also allows them to sit louder in a mix.

Do I understand your low-fi statement correctly that you say that a lower sampling rate does support less harmonics?

SanderXpander · Post by **SanderXpander** » Mon Sep 23, 2013 5:33 pm

Well yeah that last part is sort of a given simply from a technical standpoint (the Nyquist frequency). It may be a reason why Korg for so many years now insisted on using a 48KHz sampling rate whereas most competitors stayed at 44.1KHz. Apart from the sampling rate, the actual quality of the converters (and in some cases, the samples) has increased as well, which, again, means more precise sound and often more harmonic content.

For the rest, I didn't really mean "true analog" vs digital, that's a more complicated discussion. Analog synths have an entirely different way of producing sound. That said, digital models of analogs do try to model analog behavior so most VAs won't really have "perfect" squares or saws either. A synth like AL-1 with waveshaping lets you determine how much of an edge your wave has so if it's too bright for you (even pre-filter), go ahead and adjust it.

As for the OP, I am convinced that if the sounds of the LE appealed to him he can get good results from the Kronos even with minimal patch editing, simply adding compression, EQ, and possibly the tube preamp modeling.
Many Korg presets have (to my ears) ridiculous EQ settings, adding like 12dB of highs or lows. That may make them sound big and sparkly in isolation but makes it really hard to get them to sit in the mix loud enough without becoming obnoxious.

Corgy · Post by **Corgy** » Mon Sep 23, 2013 7:42 pm

SanderXpander wrote:Many Korg presets have (to my ears) ridiculous EQ settings, adding like 12dB of highs or lows. That may make them sound big and sparkly in isolation but makes it really hard to get them to sit in the mix loud enough without becoming obnoxious.

Oh - nice to read this - so I am not alone having this expression. But it's the case for a lot of presets of some synths that I have. Some of the sounds have been pushed up much more by effects rather than the synths and an ingenius programming.

May be I am some kind of purist - but for me a good sound lives off from the OSC section and - in case of a subtractive synth - get's a lot of it's life in the filter section. Effects should be used to smooth, distort, balance, and generate atmosphere. But don't get me wrong - I don't think, using effects for heavy sound shaping is bad practice - only sometimes it appears a little like cheating...

jeremykeys · Post by **jeremykeys** » Wed Sep 25, 2013 1:36 am

I guess it should be a bit embarrassing but I'm not entirely sure what dance music is. I mean, it seems that there are a million sub-genres so which particular one are we talking about here? I listened to a couple of things that I figure are "dance music" but I'm probably wrong. Is Deadmau5 considered to be dance music?

On another note, is the OP thinking of morek industrial type sounds like Nine Inch Nails or Skinny Puppy? Maybe using some bit crushing could be the answer. Just a thought.

anticipation · Post by **anticipation** » Wed Sep 25, 2013 5:37 pm

SanderXpander wrote:And, again, the Trance Anthem Pad is great especially if you give it a shorter attack.

Yesssss tried it and going on !!! Thank you man

I will be back

SanderXpander · Post by **SanderXpander** » Wed Sep 25, 2013 8:18 pm

jeremykeys wrote:I guess it should be a bit embarrassing but I'm not entirely sure what dance music is. I mean, it seems that there are a million sub-genres so which particular one are we talking about here? I listened to a couple of things that I figure are "dance music" but I'm probably wrong. Is Deadmau5 considered to be dance music?

On another note, is the OP thinking of morek industrial type sounds like Nine Inch Nails or Skinny Puppy? Maybe using some bit crushing could be the answer. Just a thought.

I don't know why that would be embarrassing, but then, I'm not an expert either. Dance is a pretty broad genre for me, basically computer/synth/seq based and created to dance to. Deadmau5 is dance to me, but not mainstream broadcast like Guetta or Calvin Harris I guess. Possibly deep house, if you want to give it a name?

I'm just going by the idea of commercial-ish aggressive synth sounds. Also listening to the OP's example.