X50 Editor VST Plugin routing help needed

theconnyb · Post by **theconnyb** » Tue Oct 07, 2014 10:14 pm

Hey

I am using my Korg X50 together with the X50 VST Plugin in FL Studio 11.

The problem is I can´t get the routing to the mixer right.
Normally, when a VST plugin has "multi-function", it allows you to route each Out to an individual track in the FL Studio mixer. The difference here is that normally VST plugins produce audio signals. The X50 Editor VST plugin does not. It only acts as a control to the Korg hardware synth. In other words, I can not get the signal to appear in the mixer in FL Studio when I am playing on the keys (and therefor can not control each track in the FL mixer, as wanted).

Normally, a VST "multi" plugin will have several Outs under the Processing tab, available for routing. As far as I can see, the X50 Editor VST plugin has only one Out. Does this mean it is impossible to route each channel from my Multi Program in the X50 Editor plugin to individual mixer tracks in FL Studio?

If anyone has an idea it would be greatly appreciated!

jcg · Post by **jcg** » Thu Oct 09, 2014 12:40 pm

Hi theconnyb,

The X50 syntheziser does not send or receive any audio via USB. The USB connection is for MIDI only, and the X50 editor is only used to control the X50 synth (for example, you should be able to automate some X50 parameters using the X50 editor track in the DAW). The VST editor does not produce any audio at all. So you need to use a separate audio interface to send the X50 audio to your DAW, if you want to record it too, or process it with further effects in the box.

Regards,
Jcg.

theconnyb · Post by **theconnyb** » Thu Oct 09, 2014 9:25 pm

Thanks, yes I am aware of this.

So, how exactly do I do this?

jcg · Post by **jcg** » Fri Oct 10, 2014 9:19 am

Hi,

You need one midi/instrument track to control the synth (record notes, parameter changes, etc.), and one audio track to record/process the synth sound (so you need to connect the synth's audio output to your audio interface input, and use this input in the audio track, and keep the audio track with monitoring enabled so you can hear the synth sound live in your DAW -- maybe you are missing this simple part!). The way you setup the midi/instrument track may vary from DAW to DAW. For instance, in older Cubase versions you needed to insert the VSTi instrument in the virtual instrument rack, and create a midi track pointing to the rack slot. In newer versions, you can create an Instrument track only (it will hold the VSTi too, and record midi as a regular midi track. So you setup the VSTi editor part as a regular VSTi instrument, the only difference being that it will not make any sound. Additionally, you setup an audio track as you would normally do if you just had an external synth you wanted to connect and record/process in your DAW. The DAW will not know the two (midi and audio tracks) are related though (you do). But please take a look into the X50 editor manual (http://c3.zzounds.com/media/microX50Edi ... bdf547.pdf), all is explained in detail there (starting on page 9).

Hope this helps.

Regards,
Jcg.

theconnyb · Post by **theconnyb** » Sat Oct 11, 2014 8:17 pm

Thank you for your reply.

However, maybe my question is more a FruityLoops question really. Therefor I have now also posted in a FruityLoops forum. It seems FL is not really using recording channels in the same way as Cubase.

If you could just answer one more question, maybe it could help me out though. I have carefully read the X50 manual and the connection scheme for setting the X50 up with and external Audio Interface shows that I should connect the X50 to the Audio Interface via BOTH the Individual Outputs AND the Main Outputs. Can you explain why, and if this is really important? At the moment I have the X50 connected via the Individual Outputs only. I don´t see how also connecting via the Main Outputs would make any difference? I could go out and buy 2 more cables, but I just thought I´d ask you first.

jcg · Post by **jcg** » Mon Oct 13, 2014 3:25 pm

Hi,

I think that should be the problem! As far as I know (don't have my synth here to check), normally the prog/combi sound is sent to the *Main* outputs ONLY -- this should be the case for all preset progs/combis, I suppose. If you want to send the sound to the Individual outputs, you have to manually edit the prog/combi and change the "BUS Select" option(s) there, selecting "1/2" instead of "L/R" (or "IFX"). But this has big consequences:

1. You will get no sound from the main outputs anymore (because it is either sent to the main outputs or to the individual outputs, but not both);
2. You will loose the 2 Master Effects and Master EQ, at least, because you can only route audio to the Individual outputs ("1/2") either from the oscillators output directly (in this case, you will also loose the Insert FX), or just after the Insert FX. In any case, the Master FXs and EQ will not be used (for this Prog).

So please try to connect the X50 main outputs to you audio interface inputs, and it should be fine, I guess. I think the X50 Editor manual shows the full picture just in case you want to use the individual outputs too for some reason (for example, if you are using a Multi and want to send the drums sound to a separate stereo track -- without Master FXs and EQ -- while all the remaining sounds are sent to the master output as usual).

Regards,
jcg.

theconnyb · Post by **theconnyb** » Tue Oct 21, 2014 8:02 am

A detailed description of my problem follows below:

1. I have my KORG X50 synthesizer connected to my PC computer as shown in the KORG X50 manual (p. 34).

2. My MIDI settings in FL Studio as shown above. I load the X50 Plug-in Editor into FL Studio.

3. I choose MULTI and add one new MIDI Out Channel for every instrument I wish to use in the Multi Combination. In this case 4 MIDI Outs.

4. In the X50 Plug-in Editor I go into Settings and change Output port to "1".

5. On all four MIDI Outs I change MIDI Out port to "1", and set MIDI Out Channel to 1, 2, 3 and 4 accordingly. Now each MIDI Out has its own instument linked from the Multi Combination in X50 Plug-in Editor.
MIDI Out #1 (B020 Standard Kit)
MIDI Out #2 (C059 E. Bass Finger)
MIDI Out #3 (A113 Romance Piano)
MIDI Out #4 (D012 Fingertips Guitar)
The instruments are playable and recordable in FL Studio, but does not yet show up in the FL Studio Mixer.

6. I assign X50 Plug-in Editor to Mixer Track 5 in FL Studio.

7. I set input of Mixer Track 5 to "Analog In 1 Fast Track Ultra". Now Mixer Track 5 gives a visual respons of input signal.

8. I assign the MIDI Out Channels to their own Mixer Tracks in FL Studio. But in order to get a visual signal for these Mixer Tracks, I must also set "Mixer Track In" to "Analog In 1 Fast Track Ultra" on these Mixer Tracks as well. However, this will of course result in the current instrument being played also sounding on ALL Mixer Tracks using "Analog In 1 Fast Track Ultra".

9. In X50 Plug-in Editor under PROCESSING, only one Output can be seen (1. Output 1). This value goes up to 99 but makes no difference when changed.
In other "Multi Out"-Plug-ins, up to 16 Outs can be selected, edited and linked to separate Mixer Tracks in FL Studio. I am sure this is also possible with X50 Plug-in, but the question is how when there is only one Out available for choice from X50 Plug-in Editor.

So, How can I assign each channel from X50 Plug-in Editor to individual Mixer Tracks in FL Studio Mixer to apply effects and control volume and panning?

jcg · Post by **jcg** » Wed Oct 22, 2014 11:58 am

Hi theconnyb,

Ok, now I understand what you are trying to do and what the problem is. And the problem is that you are trying to do something which is simply not possible. You will NEVER get separate audio channels for each individual Multi part! At least not "live" (I mean, in such a way that you are playing the song and listening to the X50 output live with each part of the Multi routed to it's own audio track in FL).

Let's see: As you know already, the X50 Edit VST plugin does not produce any audio. So it could never work as a "multi out" (audio) plugin with all the separate tracks. It will not work even as a single audio output plugin (maybe it appears to have a stereo output in the DAW, but it will not output any sound from it at all). The audio from the X50 must come (exclusively) from its physical outputs (in the rear panel), and that's why you need to connect those to your audio interface, in order to hear (and record, process) the audio in FL. And this is a stereo (2 channels) connection (or 4 channels max, if you are using the additional 1/2 connectors), so it is physically impossible to have all Multi parts routed to separate audio tracks in FL, as the audio is coming from just 2 (or 4, max) audio channels.

So it seems to me that you are doing everything well until step 7 (inclusive), which is to have a stereo track in FL with the stereo output from the X50 (stereo mix), and midi tracks to record each part performance (midi notes, not audio). But that's how far you can go (in the remaining steps you are trying to do something which is not possible).

If you want to process the Multi parts separately, what you can do is:

1. While working in the song (recording parts), use the midi tracks and the Editor plugin (to adjust the X50 multi and parts, and save all X50 parameters in your FL project, to have total recall every time you open the project again). And also use the stereo audio track if you need it to monitor the X50 stereo output in FL while working.

2. After you have recording and want to start mixing your song, record each Multi part to a separate audio track in FL. You need to do it separately for each part (create an audio track assigned to the audio interface input, solo the MIDI track for that part, play the song and record the audio track at the same time). At the end, mute the MIDI and X50 Editor tracks and work with the audio tracks exclusively (edit, process, etc.). If you need to re-record some part, you need to re-record it again into its audio track.

I hope this helps!

Regards,
jcg.

tommymandel · Post by **tommymandel** » Wed Oct 22, 2014 3:55 pm

jcg, that was a great, clear, detailed and patient answer.
I'd like to nominate you for the X50 Hall of Fame.

jcg · Post by **jcg** » Wed Oct 22, 2014 5:55 pm

Hi tommy,

Thanks! I hope it qualifies for some free Korg gear!

Regards.

theconnyb · Post by **theconnyb** » Tue Jan 20, 2015 3:28 pm

Thanks a lot jcg, I do realize now what you mean. It became very clear now.

Anyway, I am now going to do as you say and convert those midi-tracks to audio-tracks. I have been doing this for a couple of nights now just to try it but I can´t help to feel I am doing this wrong.

Let´s say I have 5 midi-tracks playing (with sounds generated by the KORG).
My KORG is connected to my audio interface´s input channels 1 and 2. The FL Studio Mixer master channel has the audio interface´s channel 1 and 2 as input.

What I do next is:

1) I select a free mixer channel, set the input to M-Audio Stereo channel 1 and 2 (same as the master has)

2) I remove the input on the master channel (or mute it) so that my other mixer channel is the only channel with M-Audio stereo in channel 1 and 2

3) I solo the midi-track I wish to record (or "convert" to an audio-track) and press Record

4) Now I have an audio recording of my midi track

5) Now I must select A NEW FREE MIXER CHANNEL and set its input to M-Audio stereo in channel 1 and 2. (I can not use the same one as before, for some reason)

6) I repeat this process for every track in the project.

Am I doing this the right way? Or is there a simpler way to do this?