Wave File Playback - Tempo and Pitch incorrect

[MRedZac]

Hello all,

I use Kronos often to play back some wave files (Backing Tracks), which are stored on the internal ssd. They are linked via sampling mode as Multisample to a specific key, converted to a programm and then used in a Combination to be triggered by a pad.

From time to time it happens that if I trigger one of these wave files, that they do not start in the correct tempo and pitch, but slower and less high - just like you are playing a 48 kHz File back with a 44 kHz setting...

I cannot say, that this is regular or that it happens if I did this and this and that... No, it´s very seldom and sporadic, but if once this will happen on stage, I will have a problem...

Any suggestions about this topic on how to make sure, this doesn´t happen again ?

Thanks for your precious help in advance !

Cheers
Garfield

[Sharp]

Are you using the Transpose in Global mode from time to time? My guess is that may cause a problem if you forget it's activated. Joystick bend would probably also effect it.

I've never seen anything odd like that happen myself before but that being said, I'd never use the KRONOS like that. It seems a very strange way to run a wave file. If it were me I'd stream the audio from an Audio Track in the sequencer. This way your not wasting sample RAM and you can select whatever sounds you want to play over the track.

Regards
Sharp.

[danatkorg]

I'm 100% certain that this will be deterministic. There is nothing sporadic about sample playback on the KRONOS.

[MRedZac]

Are you using the Transpose in Global mode from time to time? My guess is that may cause a problem if you forget it's activated. Joystick bend would probably also effect it.

I've never seen anything odd like that happen myself before but that being said, I'd never use the KRONOS like that. It seems a very strange way to run a wave file. If it were me I'd stream the audio from an Audio Track in the sequencer. This way your not wasting sample RAM and you can select whatever sounds you want to play over the track.

Regards
Sharp.

Hello Sharp,

thanks for your reply, but definitely nothing to do with transpose or joystick... To me, it is something like a software bug and I cannot reproduce it on purpose. But coming to your description how you would stream an audio file, I´m asking myself, if with this method you are able to launch the file by pressing a pad from Korgs Nanopad or you have to press start ? Are the audiofiles already loaded up, while the Kronos is booted or is there something to load manually after each restart ? (With my method, Kronos loads all "samples" automatically while boot up, no manual action to be taken anymore, just press the Pad and everything is running, directly from the setlist. - More than this, I´m always using several audiofiles, which run paralell to each other, like backing file, click file, backing vocals and percussion, all of these routed to the different outputs on the backside. Would that still be possible with your solution and if yes, is there some small "step by step" guide on how to do it, since I find my way of doing it really complicated in terms of its creation and setup, but haven´t found another way, yet, which is easier on stage for the playback...

Thanks again.

[SanderXpander]

Accidentally touching/brushing the NanoPad's X-Y pad can potentially cause a pitch bend (depending on the program's configuration) and by default it will lock to the bottom left position after touching and releasing it. Perhaps this has something to do with it?

[QuiRobinez]

Would that still be possible with your solution and if yes, is there some small "step by step" guide on how to do it, since I find my way of doing it really complicated in terms of its creation and setup, but haven´t found another way, yet, which is easier on stage for the playback...

I think there is some misunderstanding, the method sharp describes is the way to go for backing tracks in sequence songs. What you are doing is playing 'long' samples in combis (probably as one shot samples) and calling them backing tracks.

This is a totally different way of working and not comparable.

I use both methods, i never experienced that behavior you have mentioned so since you use the HD-1 module to play back your samples i'm positive that it's something in the combi or program that is causing the ocassional out of tune sample problem. A transpose down setting assigned to the SW1 button could be the problem for instance.

The Sharp method (in the song) will never be out of tune, since the song is just streamed from the SSD from the position in the song where you assigned it to.

The HD-1 module has lot's of synth parameters effecting your sample. This is actually a good thing since you can do all kind of tricks on it this way. For instance i have drumloops triggered by a KARMA pattern which sents a note on message every 4 beats to retrigger the loop. Or i have a Mashup vocal where i added Square LFO effects so that i can do 'stutter effects' live on the vocals when i play the track in combi mode. It's extremely powerful to use it this way.

So when it's happening again, just check what you did differently (knob states, KARMA scenes, etc...)

[MRedZac]

Would that still be possible with your solution and if yes, is there some small "step by step" guide on how to do it, since I find my way of doing it really complicated in terms of its creation and setup, but haven´t found another way, yet, which is easier on stage for the playback...

I think there is some misunderstanding, the method sharp describes is the way to go for backing tracks in sequence songs. What you are doing is playing 'long' samples in combis (probably as one shot samples) and calling them backing tracks.

This is a totally different way of working and not comparable.

I use both methods, i never experienced that behavior you have mentioned so since you use the HD-1 module to play back your samples i'm positive that it's something in the combi or program that is causing the ocassional out of tune sample problem. A transpose down setting assigned to the SW1 button could be the problem for instance.

The Sharp method (in the song) will never be out of tune, since the song is just streamed from the SSD from the position in the song where you assigned it to.

The HD-1 module has lot's of synth parameters effecting your sample. This is actually a good thing since you can do all kind of tricks on it this way. For instance i have drumloops triggered by a KARMA pattern which sents a note on message every 4 beats to retrigger the loop. Or i have a Mashup vocal where i added Square LFO effects so that i can do 'stutter effects' live on the vocals when i play the track in combi mode. It's extremely powerful to use it this way.

So when it's happening again, just check what you did differently (knob states, KARMA scenes, etc...)

Thanks Qui, for your detailled answer. Well, I was thinking about all that possible influences you describe as well, but in fact it just happens (if it happens!) by doing nothing else than selecting any slot where a sample is behind in setlist mode and press a pad on nanopad to trigger the sample. If it comes out wrong, I step through another two slots from setlist to stop the sample, go back to the slot where my sample is located and press the pad again, which triggers the sample again and it´s playing correct. I do not change anything, I do not touch anything else but a single pad on nanopad. No joystick, no controller, no transpose, no other buttons, no other pads. I would say from 100 times triggering a sampe, 1-2 times it starts playing wrong, no matter what sample. Interesting thing is, that there´s all the samples of a song playing slowly then... not just one. It´s like a global setting for all that combi has/is changed all of a sudden... So for example if I have in one combi "long" samples for backing file, one for click and one for backing vocals, all the three play in "slow motion", not only one of them...

[QuiRobinez]

Well, I was thinking about all that possible influences you describe as well, but in fact it just happens (if it happens!) by doing nothing else than selecting any slot where a sample is behind in setlist mode and press a pad on nanopad to trigger the sample. If it comes out wrong, I step through another two slots from setlist to stop the sample, go back to the slot where my sample is located and press the pad again, which triggers the sample again and it´s playing correct.

I do not change anything, I do not touch anything else but a single pad on nanopad. No joystick, no controller, no transpose, no other buttons, no other pads. I would say from 100 times triggering a sampe, 1-2 times it starts playing wrong, no matter what sample. Interesting thing is, that there´s all the samples of a song playing slowly then... not just one.

I can't explain it, i never experienced this. It still sounds like it receives pitch bend information (maybe a broken nanopad 2?). I doubt that the sample rate of the kronos changes from 48 kHz tot 44.1khz randomly. As far as i know the samplerate of the kronos is fixed on 48 khz.

What you could try is to remove the pitchbend setting from the default 2 to value 0. Or you can remove the pitch slope so that the sample always plays on it's own pitch. Since you can't replicate it at will it's hard to determine what's causing it.


removing the pitch functionality from the Joystick and ribben can be done by:
- pressing the Osc/Pitch tab
- press osc1 pitch subtab
- enter the value of 0 at the ribbon parameter
- enter the value of 0 at the JS(+X) parameter
- enter the value of 0 at the JS(-X) parameter


removing the pitch slope can be done by:
- pressing the Osc/Pitch tab
- press osc1 pitch subtab
- enter the value of 0 at the pitch slope paramteer

After you have done this you could rule out that it's something that's caused by another keyboard, nanopad or some setting.

[SanderXpander]

Like I said, lightly brushing the XY pad could have this effect. Perhaps 1 or 2 times in a hundred, you do this by accident. That or it's faulty.