Second Hour with new electribe

[DrHoo]

Ok, only factory patterns with the same settings change quite well but then i didn't buy this for factory patterns, & i'm deleting them all. In fact it makes no sense to compare weather a factory pattern or a user pattern changes any differently, a pattern is a pattern whoever wrote it. This is simply about the ins fx cut off which happens on every pattern change. The cut off imo is a complete bollox-up on the part of Korg & we shouldn't even be discussing work arounds for something like this, not in this age.

Try this then, 1. Make a pattern you like, 2.copy it to the next pattern location, 3. In the first pattern mute half the parts but leave something with an ins fx unmuted, 4. In the second pattern unmute all parts.... Notice anything ? Now try muting the same mutes on each pattern, writ them both & then play them one after the other... How's that now ?

Be honest.

[apapdop]

Ok, only factory patterns with the same settings change quite well but then i didn't buy this for factory patterns, & i'm deleting them all. In fact it makes no sense to compare weather a factory pattern or a user pattern changes any differently, a pattern is a pattern whoever wrote it. This is simply about the ins fx cut off which happens on every pattern change. The cut off imo is a complete bollox-up on the part of Korg & we shouldn't even be discussing work arounds for something like this, not in this age.

Try this then, 1. Make a pattern you like, 2.copy it to the next pattern location, 3. In the first pattern mute half the parts but leave something with an ins fx unmuted, 4. In the second pattern unmute all parts.... Notice anything ? Now try muting the same mutes on each pattern, writ them both & then play them one after the other... How's that now ?

Be honest.

I agree with you, i have no problem with deleting the factory programs. I would have deleted them straight away if there was a quick way of doing so, like there is on the esx-1. I think the glitch issue has nothing to do with insert fx, that is why i mentioned that the problem is barely noticeable on the factory patterns. I think it is to do with the number of parts that are muted in the incoming pattern. The factory patterns all have few or no parts muted. I think that is the key. I have made two patterns with all 16 parts active, no parts muted, insert fx going, the works. Switching between them results in a smooth transition. If i then mute 14 parts of the second pattern, leaving only 2 parts unmuted and it doesn't matter if insert fx are active or not, i get the glitch when switching between the two!!

I'm without my electribe (boohoo) for a couple of days, but i will gladly try your suggested experiment when i get home. But in which of your two scenarios do you get the problem?

[DrHoo]

In both really & that's my point. I hear you though, deffo when all (Or nearly all) parts are flying there's a better pattern change transition but it means we have to adapt to the machine rather than have a tool which we can use to our own required ends ! Know what i'm saying ? It means we're tied into a certain workflow & that to me deprives us of freedom of expression in music.

[Re-Member]

The pattern change blip IS aparrent in the preset patterns & i don't know of a decent practical work around worth trying.

Ok, say one factory preset is at 100bpm. The next one is releted to the previous one, so it'll be at the same bpm, similar setting for each part, similar master fx etc. In my experience, swapping from the first to the second will sound fine, my eyebrows aren't raising.

We have two conflicting statements here. I think sound samples are in order so we can hear exactly what the other is referring to.

The way I see it is that if most of preset patterns don't have any major problems, then something in the sound parameters is causing this glitch to occur when people are trying program patterns of their own. If we can pinpoint exactly what it is, it's worth emailing Korg about.

Thing worth testing:
- Number of Insert FXs being used per pattern
- Number of Parts that have "Part Priority" turned on
- Number of Parts with note data on them, even if they are saved as being muted (the machine still has to load this data)
- Difference in tempo settings between patterns

[roblabs]

@Re-Member I've also already mentioned this, that current electribe2 owners should be emailing Korg about any bugs or issues they're dealing with. Don't expect Korg to come strolling into this forum and read every single post, or any at all, on these problems and concerns. Take an active step and start emailing them about things that might be improved! Honestly, if we all keep doing this, we may just get some relevant updates to the OS! As soon as I get mine I will be sure to be doing this.

[DrHoo]

It makes no difference weather it's a factory pattern or a user one, same thing, a pattern is a pattern. What do you imagine that they can do that we can't ? I mean, the machine has only so many features to program. You can't program out the cut. Even if you stop the playback & listen to the tailing sounds, if you change pattern it cuts everything.

[Re-Member]

You can't program out the cut. Even if you stop the playback & listen to the tailing sounds, if you change pattern it cuts everything.

Well then why did apapdop say the following:

I have made two patterns with all 16 parts active, no parts muted, insert fx going, the works. Switching between them results in a smooth transition. If i then mute 14 parts of the second pattern, leaving only 2 parts unmuted and it doesn't matter if insert fx are active or not, i get the glitch when switching between the two!!

I think the two of you are talking about two entirely different things here. He's talking about an audio "glitch," not the FXs tails being cut. The Insert FXs being cut is already documented and expected. The "glitch" on the other hand, is only happening in certain situations.

Based on what he wrote, it sounds like if you switch to a pattern which has a muted Part, there's an audio glitch. Perhaps the machine is being slow to trigger the mute settings, so you get a short pop of audio from each Part before the mute kicks in.

[1_inch_punch]

I must be the only guy not deleting the factory patterns. Being too much a novice i have been attempting to record the parameters for all parts. Its incredibly tedious and I may bail before completing the task but i have learned a bit through only the few patterns completed so far.
Dr Hoo's thread on dropping the pattern's overall volume level seems to prevail as well as dropping the parts volume for IFXed parts.
Of patterns that obviously meant to be grouped or follow each other - of those i have noted so far, mind.... - very few parts are muted and in a number of cases parts havent been muted, they just dont have any notes recorded. They play when you roll into the following pattern.

One unfortunate discovery i made while making a synth sound based on my notes from a factory pattern which shocked me as i was able to duplicate it, make sure you WRITE that pattern before you change from keyboard to trigger and pressing another part - if you havent Written it, even though you are still inside the Pattern , changing the Part will wipe your settings.
I am sticking with it but if you were tossing up between Gadget and buying this I sould say go Gadget - at this point in time

[Re-Member]

Someone should test this to see if it causes a glitch:

1. Starting from a pattern that is entirely clear of data, set up a Part that has a long Amp release.
2. Record yourself holding a single note that ends right at the end of the pattern.
3. On another Part, record a basic 4/4 bass drum beat.
4. Save the pattern onto two different pattern locations.
5. On pattern location 2, erase all the note data, but leave all the parameters the same, then save the pattern making sure both Parts are left unmuted.
6. Test if switching from pattern 1 to pattern 2 causes the glitch.

[apapdop]

I'm convinced that the problem i'm talking about is down to parts being muted. I'm using inset fx on nearly every part in the patterns i'm creating, but these insert fx are not delay based, so there are no tails to carry over (or get chopped off!!) into the next pattern. I am using a delay on the master fx and several parts feed into that. The tails from this master fx delay carry over smoothly when i switch patterns. I think its as re-member describes, the machine isn't dealing with the mute states quick enough on pattern changes. If only a few parts are muted in the incoming pattern, then it can deal with it. But if most of the parts are muted, then it struggles...

[Re-Member]

I think its as re-member describes, the machine isn't dealing with the mute states quick enough on pattern changes. If only a few parts are muted in the incoming pattern, then it can deal with it. But if most of the parts are muted, then it struggles...

Well, this sounds like a step in a right direction toward finding some better work arounds, at the very least. If you're aiming to program a linear song using multiple patterns, instead of muting any unused parts, simply adjust the part volumes to be 0 so you can then manually fade them in when needed using the Amp Level knob (this is a trick I do on my MC-505). Or just delete those parts for that portion of the song completely.

If it is indeed the mute triggers being delayed, that seems like something Korg could fix that wouldn't be too taxing on the engine. Perhaps they overlooked this problem because the majority of the preset patterns don't have a lot of muted parts.

[apapdop]

I think its as re-member describes, the machine isn't dealing with the mute states quick enough on pattern changes. If only a few parts are muted in the incoming pattern, then it can deal with it. But if most of the parts are muted, then it struggles...

Well, this sounds like a step in a right direction toward finding some better work arounds, at the very least. If you're aiming to program a linear song using multiple patterns, instead of muting any unused parts, simply adjust the part volumes to be 0 so you can then manually fade them in when needed using the Amp Level knob (this is a trick I do on my MC-505). Or just delete those parts for that portion of the song completely.

If it is indeed the mute triggers being delayed, that seems like something Korg could fix that wouldn't be too taxing on the engine. Perhaps they overlooked this problem because the majority of the preset patterns don't have a lot of muted parts.

I'm sure there will be simple workarounds and the volume to 0 trick did cross my mind. The most obvious one is changing patterns when you want an increase in musical activity rather than a decrease. And to be honest, i'm having plenty of fun working within a single 4 bar pattern filled with 16 parts, muting/unmuting and twiddling knobs. Which is kind of what i wanted from the new Electribe in the first place. I don't have a studio of equipment for it to control or be controlled from, i've got an ipad, an esx-1 and nothing else. I'm not wanting it to be a sequencing powerhouse either. I just wanted it to jam on and improve my live performance ability, whilst staying in the familiar Electribe enviroment. What is really telling though is that we are visiting my inlaws for a couple of days at the moment. I have my ipad and a pair of headphones. I can sneak off and work on a musical project on the ipad no problem. But i really, really miss my new Electribe...

[roblabs]

One unfortunate discovery i made while making a synth sound based on my notes from a factory pattern which shocked me as i was able to duplicate it, make sure you WRITE that pattern before you change from keyboard to trigger and pressing another part - if you havent Written it, even though you are still inside the Pattern , changing the Part will wipe your settings.
I am sticking with it but if you were tossing up between Gadget and buying this I sould say go Gadget - at this point in time

Whoa...which settings don't save? The settings on the matrix (osc, mod, eg, etc) or the notes themselves? I really hope this is a glitch or something....what os are you on? I intend to use this live for jamming and the like....I really hope this isn't the case, the old electribes are nothing like this and if this is the situation now, man....that would really be bad in every way.

[1_inch_punch]

Relax -

when it happened last nite i just shutdown everything in disgust after spending so much time - I fired it up this morning and tried again.

The changed settings are holding once you go to a different part and return - - all I can put it down to is I had the same part copied onto 4 different pads. i was going to vary each one mildly.

When I went back to the part I thought I had altered all I can assume now is I hit an unaltered pad. Then I saw red and let illogicality reign.