PA4X vs T5 basic comparison

[siebenhirter]

Continuation2 - One dealing with Auto-Select will realize (if not already known) that so often criticized lack of opportunity changing style sounds while playing in the direct-access is possible.

It is possible by Auto-Select-Sound, because there is a link list for the last used sounds per sound bank, which can be used either temporary or can be stored in internal memory (it is the same list like performance-list-last-selected).

For style-track-drums you choose a drum-set in the drum sound bank, as well as a drum sound in a user bank, so you have already three different drum sounds for direct-access. When the drum track is active (Sound Volume black in Style Play screen background) just select the original drum kit by checking from "Original Style Sound" and the other two drum sets in the direct access to the two buttons of the performance/sound banks.

The same applies to changes of bass sounds - for style-track-bass select a second bass sound (not in the same sound bank as the drum sets), but in the sound bank for bass sounds and the third bass sound in the second user-soundbank. so that is the same procedure as when changing the drum sets available for direct-access. For this purpose, however, the bass track in Style Play screen must be activated.

For sounds the performance/sound-select-button is set to Sound mode (naturalemente) - and you only can use Auto-Select-Sound-Mode with previous models, as last product-line (pa300/600/900 .. ) comes with no buttons for sounds.

[Pfeff]

After having both a Pa3X and Tyros 5 for the past 18 months, decided to let one go. I've kept the Tyros. Once it gained a 76 note keyboard it got the last feature missing from the T4 and reason I bought my Pa. I just found the voices, especially the Organworld, its styles, more flexible use of HD and USB including playing styles etc direct from the device and powerful registration system (I don't think Pete really grasped the flexibility of the Tyros), made keeping the Tyros a no brainer for me.

That said, the Pa was an awesome arranger and understand why others would disagree with my choice. How lucky we are to have such instruments to play.

[karmathanever]

I don't think Pete really grasped the flexibility of the Tyros

I had my Tyros for a long time - whilst I still don't like its registrations there were too many other things (for me) that made it very restrictive in a performance or recording situation.
I definitely grasped its flexibility but the discomfort in accessing and using that flexibility was a serious issue for me.
Tyros' OS is lazy and old - OK you could say that the PA hasn't changed much either - true - but it was so very much better in the first place.

These are purely my experiences and personal views based on personal needs.
I recorded my band with same songs equally using Tyros and PA with no double tracking and found that there were too many things I wanted to change on the Tyros recordings - mainly due to being unable to control the Tyros whilst live recording, so the difference really was "chalk and cheese" - sold the "chalk"

There is no way I would be comfortable with a Tyros on stage - I'd feel very restricted.

Tyros has some very nice features but I think Yamaha should start pushing it towards the professional market - I'm referring to "live performance".

I am not being unpleasant to Yamaha - just my views but if you want a list of its limitations I am happy to provide it - it has all been said before I guess.

Absolutely have to agree that Tyros Organs are years ahead of the PA - Korg have not yet produced a nice clean "tone wheel organ/Leslie" emulation - this is why I have a Roland VR09.

Cheers John

Pete

[Pfeff]

Totally understand Pete... To each their own as they say. Thank goodness for both of us that we have the choice.

Unlike you, I don't play professionally so have different needs. In fact while I agree the Tyros is not perfect (which arranger is?), and could well use some changes, I'm glad the two are different. If they were the same, they'd perhaps appeal to one type of musician to the possible exclusion of the other. Both are great instruments.

Just back on the Registrations for a minute, there's a thread on PSR Tutorial currently debating the lack of linking registrations from Music Finder. There are ways around this as explained in the thread. I for one have only just grasped this workaround. Hence my comment earlier. But you probably had already used that method.

[karmathanever]

Ah!! Musicfinder - only used that a few times - didn't suit my requirements but I am prepared to admit that I didn't spend much time with it - maybe it could have resolved my "set list" requirements????

Cheers

Pete

[Bachus]

Ah!! Musicfinder - only used that a few times - didn't suit my requirements but I am prepared to admit that I didn't spend much time with it - maybe it could have resolved my "set list" requirements????

Cheers

Pete

Nope probably not, musicfinder is a good thing for finding styles... But it fails as a setlist as you can not add performance memmory or banks to it...

Most pro players on psrtutorial agree Korg is doing a much better job when it comes to this feature

[AdmirR]

Ah!! Musicfinder - only used that a few times - didn't suit my requirements but I am prepared to admit that I didn't spend much time with it - maybe it could have resolved my "set list" requirements????

Cheers

Pete

Song Book is way better than Musicfinder.I am Yamaha owner since psr-9000 trough all Tyros's and I newer use Musicfinder(before Music data base).

[Dikikeys]

Is there a moderator that can split off this discussion of the Registration system on Yamaha's (their pros and cons) and give it its own thread?

We seem to have diverged considerably between the original intent of the thread, and I'm sure it is important enough to deserve its own thread...

[karmathanever]

Compared to other threads nearby, this is not so far off track - we are still discussing PA and Tyros comparisons.

Current comparisons above covering registrations/performances/songbook/musicfinder - not too irrelevant really.

By all means start another topic - perhaps in PA3X or Other Korg Arrangers section as it relates to many models.

[eli125]

5,1 GB PCM samples vs 760 MB….. +1K

it dose not meter much it is it meters how nice and real it is sampled

[Bachus]

5,1 GB PCM samples vs 760 MB….. +1K

it dose not meter much it is it meters how nice and real it is sampled

True...

But with the same quallity sound engineers, you can have atleast some sparkling instrumetns like top knotch piano's with 5GB

[Bachus]

Some questions, about multipads....

How does the korg Pa series pads compare to the Tyros 5 multipads..

- can you transpose audio pads
- can you sync audio pads to the tempo of a style..
- some of the best T5 midi pads use megavoices, can you have guitarmode active in a korg pad?
- can you loop, single shot, restart every pad on the fly?

[valio7771]

Here's a nice demo on how to create Registrations on T4
https://youtu.be/kTezAE86ftk

- BUT how is one expected to "remember" what is where when you're gigging and you've created 200 registrations?
That was my point (again - personal needs) - as I asked above

I found the "Registrations" to be horrible and archaic - what was I missing? (serious question)

I am seriously keen to know if I have missed something here and NOT picking a PA/Tyros fight
On my PA my set list is displayed in front of me in the song sequence I choose for the gig and can be modified in a few seconds and I can switch set lists in a second.

Cheers

Pete

That video was actually a good example of how to set a performance in the most confusing and unnecessarily complicated way that I could have ever imagine. I seriously never though there was a such long and frustrating way to do such simple task...like REALLY !!!

1. Why would you MASTER RESET the Registration at all, for that matter? That makes no sense!
2. Why would he have to spare 5 Registrations for 1 song, considering he'll use same style and 1 or 2 different sounds?....that's just a no brainer.
Is it so much more difficult to press the actual Fill-in buttons instead of Registration buttons?

Here how it's done, fast and effective:
Pick a Style, pick up to 4 layered sounds that you may need for that particular song (and save them in the One Touch buttons by 'long press'), set the keyboard the way you'd want it to find it for that particular song with all it's FX, Levels, Mic, Vocalist, etc.... press Memory and Registration Number, name it.....DONE!
Than going to the gig, and you find you didn't like something on the settings you've did because you weren't listening it through the PA, do the changes until you like it.....simply press Memory and Performance Number....FIXED !

I don't need to mark/unmark checkboxes for a particular change inside the entry, and everytime to confirm 'Yes' to overwrite the changes that I just made when I'm 'on fly' and my hands should have been on the keys 4 bars ago, while singing and eventually pay attention to the lyrics on the iPad.
Here an example, I'm playing with style but I feel like I want to change the feeling of the song and I decide I want to use the M.Bass, simply by pressing the button it turns off the accompaniment instantly leaving only the drums, instead of waiting for the next chord change and muting only the bass part. So I have to press the Chord Scan for Upper (because If I'm going to play single note Bass in the Lower, is it not logicall to presume that I'm going to be playing the chords in the Upper so it could automatically change it by it self?), and there's always that slight awkward 'drummer solo' gap no matter how fast you make the switch because you have to lift both of your hands of the keys in order to do it as fast possible. In 90% of the time in making the switch inevitably leads to adjusting some volume levels. And after all that if I want to save it like that, it won't do it until I unmark the 'Original Style sounds' checkbox, press Songbook button, go to Book edit 1 page, check the Write current boxes on Style and STS, chose on drop menu in which STS number I want to save it, press Write on the bottom of the screen, confirm with OK on a pop-up screen...come on....I just waned to play the god damned bass, than click a single button to save it.
The ease of having a touch screen is incomparable in general, and Songbook is much highly customizable and more informative on the display than Yamaha's Performances, but it is more so much more time consuming and overly complicated...especially if you need to make quick small or even radical changes 'on fly'. To be fair, I've never needed to use Yamaha's MusicFinder namely because Registrations are so much easy to deal with on stage. Songbook is very flexible and fortunate tool to have at your disposal, but it's not designed in a helpful way.

I know there isn't a perfect keyboard and probably never will be made, not because it's impossible to build one, but because of marketing interests...that's more than clear (and unfortunate).

[Pfeff]

<SNIP>
2. Why would he have to spare 5 Registrations for 1 song, considering he'll use same style and 1 or 2 different sounds?....that's just a no brainer.
Is it so much more difficult to press the actual Fill-in buttons instead of Registration buttons?

Here how it's done, fast and effective:
Pick a Style, pick up to 4 layered sounds that you may need for that particular song (and save them in the One Touch buttons by 'long press'), set the keyboard the way you'd want it to find it for that particular song with all it's FX, Levels, Mic, Vocalist, etc.... press Memory and Registration Number, name it.....DONE!

This is not correct. On a T5, you can edit the default OTS voices but you need to save the edited style in the User, HD or to USB storage. You cannot save over the default style. To have the edited voices saved in a registration, you would save them to one of the 8 buttons. Of course you can save a variation to go with that. This is why many Tyros owners use one registration bank per song. Think of it as a "Super STS" with 8 instead of only 4. Much easier finding your song from the banks than trying to find them within a bank too.

In the end, the different ways Korg and Yamaha treat these will always cause disagreement. As a previous Pa3X owner I agree the Songbook was very good and creating a setlist was easy, but there are things the T5 does that the Korg cannot too such as having a style variation select the STSs. With OTS link, the T5 can change the OTS to change with a variation change. Plus you have access to the many registration banks too.

In any case there is no perfect arranger... Yet!

PS. By having multiple registration buttons on a single song, you can set up the registration sequencer to change with the press of a foot switch. Simply set up the order you want the buttons to play, press the foot switch and all the changes are made without removing your hands from the keyboard. J

[DonM]

"T5 can change the OTS to change with a variation change."

So can Korg. As with Yamaha, you can select the mode with a button push. On PA900, the power on setup remembers the setting. On PA3x, it does not.