Genos new competitor for Korg pa4x is coming

BR · Post by BR » Sun Oct 15, 2017 9:01 pm

Yamaha Genos has very good sound quality (out of the box) according to the demos.

I would buy it if it had these features:
1- Lock tempo
2- Tactile display (directional display)
3- 61 keys version
4- Practical micro tuning scale (like Pa4X)
5- Ability to fully edit Accompaniment Tracks (Dr,Bass,etc...)
6- Localized sets (like Pa4X)
7- Most important Reasonable Price

karmathanever · Post by **karmathanever** » Mon Oct 16, 2017 4:32 am

+1

I can't figure out the logic or thought behind the design of this "seemingly" new Tyros.
Looking at the manuals and detailed specs it reads like a Tyros - almost "copy/paste".

I don't think Yamaha wanted to be revolutionary with this but are hanging on a "new name" as an illusion.
New colour, joystick, touchscreen - well at least they've made it to 2017.
Although stupidly priced like the Genos, the Audya is far more "competitive" to Korg IMHO - Audya is definitely a keyboard I would love to afford - sadly, absolutely zero support here in Australia.

Although I am being cynical, I do like Yamaha gear and would still even consider buying Genos as an "add-on" to my PA4X, but, as a main performance arranger it is still way way off for my needs.

All subjective in the end - I know!!!

Pete

BR · Post by BR » Mon Oct 16, 2017 5:20 pm

karmathanever wrote:+1

I can't figure out the logic or thought behind the design of this "seemingly" new Tyros.
Looking at the manuals and detailed specs it reads like a Tyros - almost "copy/paste".

I don't think Yamaha wanted to be revolutionary with this but are hanging on a "new name" as an illusion.
New colour, joystick, touchscreen - well at least they've made it to 2017.
Although stupidly priced like the Genos, the Audya is far more "competitive" to Korg IMHO - Audya is definitely a keyboard I would love to afford - sadly, absolutely zero support here in Australia.

Although I am being cynical, I do like Yamaha gear and would still even consider buying Genos as an "add-on" to my PA4X, but, as a main performance arranger it is still way way off for my needs.

All subjective in the end - I know!!!

Pete

Agree with you word by word.
I just add some words at what you mentioned:
I didn't read the manual but according to the demos and feedback here in the forum I think that The Genos is still way off as a main live performance arranger despite its good sounds quality.

Bachus · Post by **Bachus** » Fri Oct 20, 2017 1:00 pm

The first two Genos owners that posted reviews of the Genos on PSR tutorial where actually pro players... both owning a pa4x...

The first one has his Genos for sale... he decided to stick to pa4x.. for mostly the same reasons as a short comparrison of member Chony explains

The Korg is a much better performance instrument because:
- it is smaller
- it has tons of hardware buttons for practical live performance without the need to navigate the screen
- it has many great performance features that Yamaha doesn't have (Kaoss pad, chord cycle, ability to trigger 2/4 in a 4/4 style. etc)
- it has a more responsive screen
- sounds and style are HIGHLY editable
- you can choose 71 or 76 keys

The Yamaha is a much better studio instrument and has other advantages:
- So many of the sounds are so much better
- It is lighter than the Korg
- Very nice GUI

This probably hits the nail right on the head, its mostly the same way as its been for a very long time...

D575 · Post by **D575** » Fri Oct 20, 2017 8:14 pm

https://youtu.be/-54xmiyjUrY

pa600fan · Post by **pa600fan** » Sat Oct 21, 2017 10:32 am

I owned a psr s900 s910...then i was gona get the s970 ..i was in tue shop..there was a tyros 5 there as well.... there was a korg pa600 in the store... so i decided to play it for fun... as soon as i touched the keys i could not believe how nice it felt...more depth,more wider.. i couldnt believe how crap the 970 now felt... and the touch screen was awesome and having upper 1 2 3 was not avail on 970. The sounds and styles sounded bettee than the 970 except for flute, trumpet. (Pa700 now fixes that) i found the styles sounded better than tyros5. I cancelled my s970 order and went home with the pa600. This was 2 years ago. I no longer like yamaha arrangers since i doscovered korg is better. Ive since sold the pa600 . Getting the new korg by dec...

Sovereign · Post by **Sovereign** » Sat Oct 21, 2017 12:31 pm

Bachus wrote: This probably hits the nail right on the head, its mostly the same way as its been for a very long time...

I take exception with one statement though, from all the Genos demos I've heard I doubt "the sounds are so much better".

Bachus · Post by **Bachus** » Sat Oct 21, 2017 7:21 pm

Sovereign wrote:
Bachus wrote: This probably hits the nail right on the head, its mostly the same way as its been for a very long time...
I take exception with one statement though, from all the Genos demos I've heard I doubt "the sounds are so much better".

Well, there is something called personal prefference
And the reviewer had both instruments in the same room..
Where it comes to dsp, yamaha has made a huge step..
But then, the pa4x has 3 times the sample rom of the Genos

D575 · Post by **D575** » Sun Oct 22, 2017 1:09 pm

After Montage expectations where high for Genos but considering the very high price they are charging then we are only seeing small evolutionary changes and this make the PA4X in comparisons look like extremely good value for the money and that includes what is probably the best keybed out there before a weighted action and to think Yamaha forgot to put balanced outputs on Genos which is perplexing and PAC is just a distant dream now...so a very nice keyboard (Genos) but not worth that very high Premium price they are asking ...i may change my mind after the official event which I will attend and perhaps some down time with Genos at a dealers next time I am passing but for now the combination of keyboards I have inculding the PA4X as my master keyboard then Genos would seem to Not be the Dynamite that would move me away from the PA4X

AntonySharmman · Post by **AntonySharmman** » Sun Oct 22, 2017 1:56 pm

Too much discussion for the obvious !
Genos has better factory acoustic instruments library (pianos/guitars/Strings/Drums) , that is developed extremely good
according to Genos sound engine potentials , unlike Korg that need much improvement in the majority of good samples
that they have provided along with the worlds best sampler engine.

This is not just "personal preference" but a fact for Musicians with good knowledge of real acoustic instruments !
Therefore IMO , for a user that wants the best factory library out of box a 30% higher price is justified , the better is always
more expensive and Pro Musicians do not care about terms like "value for the money" when they fullfill their needs !

But the superirity of Genos stops there in "out of box" users and development can't exceed the already 70% realism level
(not enough for my demands) since a developer do not have deeper access in sound engine , either can use engine features
in custom sounds/styles development and those restrictions make this already expensive keyboard to be excluded from
sound developers plans , that's why I've never made sound libraries for Yamaha and finally this won't change !

Therefore , Korgies , power users and developers that have been used to customize their sound libraries and styles in the
accessible & enhanced Pa4X sound engine and style editor according to their needs , they will never target this arranger
(or any other ) regardless of better factory library or any price ...

Thanks for reading

Nev · Post by **Nev** » Sun Oct 22, 2017 2:07 pm

25+ years a Yamaha man. Recently wanted another interest and finished up with a Korg. (Great move). From Genos I expected an earthquake but have not even detected a tremor. Four seems to be the number.
I have what I consider to be the best two boards in the world.
Tyros 4 and PA4X. Very happy and content.

Sovereign · Post by **Sovereign** » Sun Oct 22, 2017 2:14 pm

Bachus wrote: Well, there is something called personal prefference
And the reviewer had both instruments in the same room..
Where it comes to dsp, yamaha has made a huge step..
But then, the pa4x has 3 times the sample rom of the Genos

Don't know about the DSP-quality, but in the end both are no match for the latest sample libraries (East West, 8Dio, etc.) when it comes to acoustic instruments. I'll take my Kontakt libraries over the Korg or Yamaha when I need 'realism'. I doubt any pro musicians who do studio work will look towards the Genos as a solution. In the end it's 'just' an arranger.

D575 · Post by **D575** » Sun Oct 22, 2017 2:32 pm

AntonySharmman wrote:Too much discussion for the obvious !
Genos has better factory acoustic instruments library (pianos/guitars/Strings/Drums) , that is developed extremely good
according to Genos sound engine potentials , unlike Korg that need much improvement in the majority of good samples
that they have provided along with the worlds best sampler engine.

This is not just "personal preference" but a fact for Musicians with good knowledge of real acoustic instruments !
Therefore IMO , for a user that wants the best factory library out of box a 30% higher price is justified , the better is always
more expensive and Pro Musicians do not care about terms like "value for the money" when they fullfill their needs !

But the superirity of Genos stops there in "out of box" users and development can't exceed the already 70% realism level
(not enough for my demands) since a developer do not have deeper access in sound engine , either can use engine features
in custom sounds/styles development and those restrictions make this already expensive keyboard to be excluded from
sound developers plans , that's why I've never made sound libraries for Yamaha and finally this won't change !

Therefore , Korgies , power users and developers that have been used to customize their sound libraries and styles in the
accessible & enhanced Pa4X sound engine and style editor according to their needs , they will never target this arranger
(or any other ) regardless of better factory library or any price ...

Thanks for reading

Well Genos is not a pro instrument that is now apparent... as for "value for the money" this is a very aprrant observation in the contents it was used in IMO and if pro musicians don't care about price Anthony you could always add 30% to your product's and not lose any sleep

AntonySharmman · Post by **AntonySharmman** » Mon Oct 23, 2017 10:56 am

D575 wrote:if pro musicians don't care about price Anthony you could always add 30% to your product's and not lose any sleep

This was done from scratch ...

As I said before the "better" always costs more , the commonly "you get what you've paid" rule ...

D575 · Post by **D575** » Mon Oct 23, 2017 3:03 pm

AntonySharmman wrote:
D575 wrote:if pro musicians don't care about price Anthony you could always add 30% to your product's and not lose any sleep
This is was done from scratch ... As I said before the "better" always costs more , the commonly "you get what you've paid" rule ...

well you definitely have something going there your C7 piano is a nice work of art and will soon find it's way into my keyboard