Styles

[Korghelper]

To get inexpensive, very high-quality styles, with a huge selection to choose from, would you forgo the ability to be able to output them via MIDI (which may be the only current way to reverse engineer and pirate them)..?

I think for the majority of regular arranger users, who just want the styles to play with and perform live, they would be willing to do this.

How do you feel?

[karmathanever]

This all depends on the pa4x owner - there are over 1200 Korg professionally produced styles already BUT some want authentic SONG-BASED styles (which I cannot personally understand too much as MIDI/MP3 is far better if you want EXACT song backing replication)

BUT as I say, this is all very subjective - producing styles from MIDI is a painstaking task at the best of times - no really great tools available either.

I personally think it's a waste of time UNLESS you have that odd one or two styles you really must have.

You asked, and that's how I feel.

Pete

P.S. please be very careful using or suggesting "pirate" on these forums - thanks

[korg1]

as MIDI/MP3 is far better if you want EXACT song backing replication

Not really....Mid works better than mp3 if it's a professional one,
cause it gives that feel of a 'live sound'' which we need
(mp3 always soundslike an mp3,no matter how perfect it is),
plus that you can jump with the marks within the midifile.

Styles on other hand,or songstyles if you prefer,is something you can always adjust to match your needs at that time.
You can play the whole or half or second intro and just chorus part and jump to next song you wanna play non-stop,creating medleys.
You can also 'save the day'' if the singer miss some parts etc.

Personally i use some MIDI's and Mp3's,which i will try to eliminate next year,or at least try to create a better sounding result either by creating a midi based style or an audio style.

[kbrkr]

I've noticed there are 3 Liverpool styles; Liverpool1, Liverpool2, and Liverpool3 in the Musikant .SET file. I created a .SET file with just these styles. How do I upload it/share it with the group? Please help Pete!

[Korghelper]

There's nothing to stop you editing a multitrack MP3 backing and change the structure to whatever you want. Mute what Parts you want (where you want to mute them) to play your own, change tempo, change key (for 'lifts' not in the original), add extra Parts either from other recordings you have (match tempo function) like percussion or guitar grooves...

An MP3 is only as good as its creator recorded it, but also the same applies to a style or SMF. As to 'sounding' like an MP3, if it is a 320kbps MP3, there are few here that could tell the difference to a 44.1/16 WAV blindfolded. Especially through the usually less than reference speakers most use!

I have no hangups about delivery systems... But then again, I'm not trying to sell anyone anything!

I use styles for some things, SMF's for others, and self-mixed multitrack MP3's for others. It depends on what I'm looking for, what I'm trying to do. I have been known to mix MP3 backings with extra choruses in case a soloist sits in. I can freely choose the long or short version. I often mix versions in different keys (but ensure the drums remain untransposed, which vastly helps mitigate transposition artifacts). I put Markers in my SMF's, and happily use Chord Sequences when I want to free a hand up.

I've got styles that sound less 'live' than some really well recorded and played MP3's. I've got some styles that sound better than what I could find on MP3 sites. It varies enormously from song to song, from track to track, from vendor to vendor.

There's no 'good' way, there's no 'bad' way. there is just what works for you.

[karmathanever]

I've noticed there are 3 Liverpool styles; Liverpool1, Liverpool2, and Liverpool3 in the Musikant .SET file. I created a .SET file with just these styles. How do I upload it/share it with the group? Please help Pete!

Best wat is to zip the SET and upload it to cloud storage like Google Drive, Mediafire or Dropbox, and then post a download link in your forum post.

Cheers

Pete

[Korghelper]

This all depends on the pa4x owner - there are over 1200 Korg professionally produced styles already BUT some want authentic SONG-BASED styles (which I cannot personally understand too much as MIDI/MP3 is far better if you want EXACT song backing replication)

BUT as I say, this is all very subjective - producing styles from MIDI is a painstaking task at the best of times - no really great tools available either.

I personally think it's a waste of time UNLESS you have that odd one or two styles you really must have.

You asked, and that's how I feel.

Pete

P.S. please be very careful using or suggesting "pirate" on these forums - thanks

I'm not suggesting anyone pirate styles. Far from it! The exact opposite, in fact. But let us not pretend it isn't going on...

I am trying to suggest a way that talented style makers can create styles, whether exact song duplicates or (and more to my taste also) less song specific genre-type styles without obvious song-specific cues (so easier to use on a wider variety of tunes) without the fear of piracy at all...

Without Korg creating a mechanism where third party styles can be loaded without any possibility of copying, the thriving industry that used to exist before rampant piracy killed it off is unlikely to make a resurgence.

It can be done. The current Roland's ROM styles are in an area unreadable by computer (the older G/E series had them in a discoverable folder if you connected the arranger to your computer and you could copy and edit them), but loaded in during the locked update file structure. Little extra needs adding to that other than an automated clearing house that would deliver the styles in that structure, and a way to defeat MIDI transmission and saving of the edited style so you can't reverse engineer them.

As you can store offsets to the Part volumes without altering the style itself, that gets around basic editing, and I have to say for myself, I would be quite happy to be able to forgo any editing capabilities if the end result was a MASSIVE increase in available low cost styles. If the style wasn't the way I wanted it, no doubt there'd be another that was!

It's the economy of scale... allow style creators the knowledge that no-one can copy, trade, pirate (or whatever euphemism the forum feels comfortable with) their work, and that each and every last style they sell will remain with one arranger, and you have a powerful incentive to create. We all enjoy the results of Korg paying creative people up front to create wonderful styles... So why not create a mechanism where equally talented (or even the same people) can create even more styles of that quality, free in the knowledge that they WILL get paid for them if they are good enough to be wanted?

I can name a bunch of genres woefully underrepresented in Korg's ROM. Reggae, Cajun, Zydeco, New Orleans Meters type funk... and that's only in my little area of the world! If you do a LOT of the underrepresented genres and there's only a couple or so of ROM styles, your set can quickly get pretty repetitive and boring. But who's going to make a bunch of zydeco styles if they get 'traded' around as soon as a few are sold? Who's going to make a bunch of funky Meters type styles knowing they are unlikely to ever make even a basic wage back once you factor in copying?

Currently, style makers are making bespoke styles at very high prices because they can't trust who they sell them to to not share them unless they paid a fortune for them. And they are making damn few. I honestly think that protecting them just like Korg have the Liverpool styles is the answer.

Economy of scale... sell one style at $100 to a couple of customers, or sell a thousand copies of a style at $1. It's basic math. It just needs a robust copy protection system.