Hello guys,
First of all, let me say how much I like this forum. There's always so much knowledge and good natured communication compared to other places where I'm searching for relative information.
So, this is my question. I have a Kronos. For so much time I was only using headphones and playing in studios. Now, I am about to buy a couple of studio monitors for home. Mainly, to play my Kronos and to make some recordings (driver recordings, tests, amateur stuff that I will later take to a professional to do the normal recording).
What I mostly care is to have a deep sound in my room, so the Kronos ambient, textures programs and combos can fill the space, create an atmosphere. I am sure you know what I'm talking about.
I would appreciate your insight and personal experience a lot. I have narrowed down my search to these:
- Yamaha HS-7: They are a bit more expensive and they have a very flat sound which is great for recording but not so great to just listen to music? You tell me if you know.
- JBL 306p: I've been hearing that they are the best in sound quality, a bit better than the Yamaha although less flat. BUT all of them come with a hissing sound, even when nothing plays. Some people hate it, others ignore it completely.
- Kali Audio LP-6: I haven't read a lot, but they are always up there with the other good monitors of that level.
Thank you in advance
Studio Monitors advice? Yamaha HS7 - JBL 306p - Kali LP6?
Moderators: Sharp, X-Trade, Pepperpotty, karmathanever
Suggest search YouTube as many reviews you can to give you speaker choices.
Remember you have not got the reviewers ears so will hear things differently.
It's all down to your own ears preference and what gives you pleasure to listen to.
A FLAT pair of headphones or speakers would be nice but you may not enjoy what you hear.
Remember you have not got the reviewers ears so will hear things differently.
It's all down to your own ears preference and what gives you pleasure to listen to.
A FLAT pair of headphones or speakers would be nice but you may not enjoy what you hear.
PA1000 + NP30 Twinset
Hi Satori,
There are many other choices out there including Adam, Neumann, etc. In the end, it's always a matter of budget and sound preferences. A simple rule is don't buy specs alone and try to test as many in stores before choosing (even though the current worldwide situation might complicate things).
One thing I would personally make sure for small monitors would be the bass response. When I bought headphones for my Kronos, I wanted an "uncolored" sound (curve as flat as possible throughout the registers) but a slight boost in the low frequencies for acoustic instruments like the piano, orchestral stuff, etc. Of course, YMMV.
There are many other choices out there including Adam, Neumann, etc. In the end, it's always a matter of budget and sound preferences. A simple rule is don't buy specs alone and try to test as many in stores before choosing (even though the current worldwide situation might complicate things).
One thing I would personally make sure for small monitors would be the bass response. When I bought headphones for my Kronos, I wanted an "uncolored" sound (curve as flat as possible throughout the registers) but a slight boost in the low frequencies for acoustic instruments like the piano, orchestral stuff, etc. Of course, YMMV.
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ChrisDuncan
- Senior Member
- Posts: 484
- Joined: Thu May 17, 2018 3:47 pm
Monitors serve a couple of different purposes, and it's important to make sure that you understand your priorities first, then choose speakers that do a good job in that area.
A related concept is whether or not a final mix from a recording is portable, meaning it sounds good in every environment. The "car test" is a good example that every studio rat is familiar with. Mix sounds awesome in your studio. Play it in your car and suddenly it's horrendous. Way too much bass / way too little bass, other frequencies disappear or are far too pronounced, things you could hear clearly in the studio fade into the mist in your car, etc.
Of course, it's not about cars but any listening environment that's not your studio. Wherever you play your music, room acoustics get a vote.
This is the reason for "flat" monitors. The new Yamahas are a tip of the hat to the legendary NS-10s (which I once owned). Sound like absolute crap in your studio, not at all gratifying, but if you could get your mix to sound good on them, you had a good chance of them sounding good in other environments.
And that highlights the other thing studio monitors are used for - listening enjoyment. It is certainly possible to have speakers you can trust (i.e. you can create a portable mix with them) that you still enjoy listening to. However, many speakers that put an emphasis on listening pleasure do so by hyping certain frequencies unnaturally, and that makes it harder for the mix to be portable.
For example, if there's a boost in some bass frequencies it may sound good in the studio. So you reduce the bass in your mix because it doesn't need as much. Then you play it in your car and since you reduced the bass because of the false feedback your monitors were giving you, you discover that the bass completely disappears in your car.
So, these are the two main roles monitor speakers serve. If you're going to track and mix somewhere else and what you really care about is a great listening experience when you're playing at home, flat monitors like the Yamahas wouldn't be the best choice. You'll want speakers that feel good, without being worried about the "truth." If you reach the point where you're mixing in your own environment, you would want the opposite.
I realize that's not the "buy brand X" that you were hoping for, but I thought if it might be more useful to give you some additional perspective on what to consider in your purchase based on your priorities. As the others have noted, there are a ton of great choices out there, and a lot of reviews.
If you're buying online, just make sure it's a store with a "no questions asked" return policy, i.e. they don't have to be defective to return them, it can be as simple as you don't like how they sound. Even if you go to a store, remember, room acoustics get a vote, so they may sound great there but not the way you like at home, so the "no questions asked" return policy is relevant there as well.
Hope this helps.
A related concept is whether or not a final mix from a recording is portable, meaning it sounds good in every environment. The "car test" is a good example that every studio rat is familiar with. Mix sounds awesome in your studio. Play it in your car and suddenly it's horrendous. Way too much bass / way too little bass, other frequencies disappear or are far too pronounced, things you could hear clearly in the studio fade into the mist in your car, etc.
Of course, it's not about cars but any listening environment that's not your studio. Wherever you play your music, room acoustics get a vote.
This is the reason for "flat" monitors. The new Yamahas are a tip of the hat to the legendary NS-10s (which I once owned). Sound like absolute crap in your studio, not at all gratifying, but if you could get your mix to sound good on them, you had a good chance of them sounding good in other environments.
And that highlights the other thing studio monitors are used for - listening enjoyment. It is certainly possible to have speakers you can trust (i.e. you can create a portable mix with them) that you still enjoy listening to. However, many speakers that put an emphasis on listening pleasure do so by hyping certain frequencies unnaturally, and that makes it harder for the mix to be portable.
For example, if there's a boost in some bass frequencies it may sound good in the studio. So you reduce the bass in your mix because it doesn't need as much. Then you play it in your car and since you reduced the bass because of the false feedback your monitors were giving you, you discover that the bass completely disappears in your car.
So, these are the two main roles monitor speakers serve. If you're going to track and mix somewhere else and what you really care about is a great listening experience when you're playing at home, flat monitors like the Yamahas wouldn't be the best choice. You'll want speakers that feel good, without being worried about the "truth." If you reach the point where you're mixing in your own environment, you would want the opposite.
I realize that's not the "buy brand X" that you were hoping for, but I thought if it might be more useful to give you some additional perspective on what to consider in your purchase based on your priorities. As the others have noted, there are a ton of great choices out there, and a lot of reviews.
If you're buying online, just make sure it's a store with a "no questions asked" return policy, i.e. they don't have to be defective to return them, it can be as simple as you don't like how they sound. Even if you go to a store, remember, room acoustics get a vote, so they may sound great there but not the way you like at home, so the "no questions asked" return policy is relevant there as well.
Hope this helps.
Control Room: Fantom 7 | JV 2080 | Cubase 13 | Windows 10 | Yamaha TF5 | Mackie MCU | CMC AI, QC, TP
Keyboard Station: Kronos 2 88 | Cubase 13 | Windows 10 | Focusrite 18i20 | CMC TP
Editing Station: Montage M8x | Cubase 13 | Windows 10 | Focusrite Scarlett 2i2
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Chris Duncan
Atlanta, GA, USA, Earth
Keyboard Station: Kronos 2 88 | Cubase 13 | Windows 10 | Focusrite 18i20 | CMC TP
Editing Station: Montage M8x | Cubase 13 | Windows 10 | Focusrite Scarlett 2i2
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Chris Duncan
Atlanta, GA, USA, Earth
Thank you all for the so quick replies. I understand that it's not an easy buy. It's very subjective based on personal needs and ears. My goal is not to spend more than 400 euros (470$).
Just when I posted this thread, a friend also advised me to buy passive monitors in order to have the control to change the amp whenever I want to upgrade. That's a whole other world to research.
I keep hearing the "flat" argument which makes much sense for recording. From what you are saying, it is a bit of a negative factor for just playing the Kronos and listening to music in general. Can that be managed successfully with an equalizer (software)?
Just when I posted this thread, a friend also advised me to buy passive monitors in order to have the control to change the amp whenever I want to upgrade. That's a whole other world to research.
I keep hearing the "flat" argument which makes much sense for recording. From what you are saying, it is a bit of a negative factor for just playing the Kronos and listening to music in general. Can that be managed successfully with an equalizer (software)?
I can highly recommend the Adam Audio T series.
I use then with my Kronos/Prologue/Minilogue and Trinity off a Focusrite interface and they sound great.
They are available in a variety of sizes to suit, and a good price for the quality you get.
https://www.adam-audio.com/en/t-series/
I use then with my Kronos/Prologue/Minilogue and Trinity off a Focusrite interface and they sound great.
They are available in a variety of sizes to suit, and a good price for the quality you get.
https://www.adam-audio.com/en/t-series/
Neil
Korg Kronos 2 88, Prologue 16, Minilogue PG, Trinity Plus/SCSI/PBS, Moog Mother 32, DFAM and Subsequent 37 owner.
Korg Kronos 2 88, Prologue 16, Minilogue PG, Trinity Plus/SCSI/PBS, Moog Mother 32, DFAM and Subsequent 37 owner.
Yes. Aside from several IFX/MFX EQ options, there is the master control from Set List mode which would make it simple to manage the acoustics.Satori wrote:I keep hearing the "flat" argument which makes much sense for recording. From what you are saying, it is a bit of a negative factor for just playing the Kronos and listening to music in general. Can that be managed successfully with an equalizer (software)?
Flat means accurate
Don’t be fooled. There’s no argument for inaccurate rooms or speakers. The Yamaha HS7 is reasonably accurate and they sound great for the $. Yes, accurate = flat. Don’t think flat as dull. If you buy speakers that are hyped or mid scooped, you won’t have an accurate reference, and your mixes will not translate well enough across a diverse range of playback mediums.
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Musicwithharry
- Platinum Member
- Posts: 694
- Joined: Fri Mar 23, 2012 3:58 am
- Location: Anamosa, IA
- Contact:
I have three pair of monitors in my studio setup:
1. JBL LSR503 - I like them and they have good bass for a 5" woofer. They get really loud and are very quiet. I do not hear a peep out of them when there is no signal present.
2. Presonus Eris 3.5 - I like these too. They are brighter than the JBL monitors, but I suspect that is because they only have a 3" woofer in them. I actually like the sound of them more than the JBL's for just playing. They also have a surprising amount of bass for a 3" woofer.
3. Alesis M1Active 320USB - these are monitors that I have had for years and they are by my laptop in another part of the house and I use them as a USB audio interface as well as for monitors. I like their sound too and they too get loud.
I guess it is really up to your ears, but you will want to make sure that whatever you get are really as flat as they can be. The spec sheet should show you their frequency curve so you can really see what is going on with them.
Additionally, your room and stuff in the room (and what's on the walls, and the walls themselves) will play a pretty big part of your sound, at least while listening to your musical creations.
Another option is a good set of studio headphones. I also use the KRK KNS6400 headphones and the Status Audio CB-1 headphones. They both sound good, but the KRK headphones are more flat than the CB-1's are. The CB-1's had rave reviews so I got a pair and they do not disappoint.
I have mixed about 5 albums on the KRK headphones and countless demos for other people and for my band. They sound really good and having headphones allows me to really dial in WHERE in the stereo field I want things (well, things that are not already in stereo).
You have a lot of choices.
Grace,
Harry
1. JBL LSR503 - I like them and they have good bass for a 5" woofer. They get really loud and are very quiet. I do not hear a peep out of them when there is no signal present.
2. Presonus Eris 3.5 - I like these too. They are brighter than the JBL monitors, but I suspect that is because they only have a 3" woofer in them. I actually like the sound of them more than the JBL's for just playing. They also have a surprising amount of bass for a 3" woofer.
3. Alesis M1Active 320USB - these are monitors that I have had for years and they are by my laptop in another part of the house and I use them as a USB audio interface as well as for monitors. I like their sound too and they too get loud.
I guess it is really up to your ears, but you will want to make sure that whatever you get are really as flat as they can be. The spec sheet should show you their frequency curve so you can really see what is going on with them.
Additionally, your room and stuff in the room (and what's on the walls, and the walls themselves) will play a pretty big part of your sound, at least while listening to your musical creations.
Another option is a good set of studio headphones. I also use the KRK KNS6400 headphones and the Status Audio CB-1 headphones. They both sound good, but the KRK headphones are more flat than the CB-1's are. The CB-1's had rave reviews so I got a pair and they do not disappoint.
I have mixed about 5 albums on the KRK headphones and countless demos for other people and for my band. They sound really good and having headphones allows me to really dial in WHERE in the stereo field I want things (well, things that are not already in stereo).
You have a lot of choices.
Grace,
Harry
Alesis Vortex Keytar, Alesis QS6.2, Alesis QSR, Alesis SR-16, Behringer Deepmind-12, Ensoniq Avista 7600, Ensoniq VFX, Ensoniq VFX-SD, Ensoniq SQ1+, (2) Ensoniq SQ-R+/32, Korg i3 (2020 Version), (2) Korg Kross 1-61, (2) Korg Kross 1-88, Korg Minilogue XD, Korg Minilogue XD Module, Korg M50-61, Korg PA700, Korg X5DR, Korg Z3, Kurzweil SP1, Lowrey EZP3 (bascially a Kawai), Roland D-05, Roland E-09, Waldorf Streichfett, Yamaha Reface CP, Yamaha Reface CS, Yamaha Reface DX, Yamaha Reface YC
Re: Studio Monitors advice? Yamaha HS7 - JBL 306p - Kali LP6
Hi Satori,
I am by no means an expert, but just a couple of things:
First, let me pile onto everything Chris Duncan said above, well put.
If you "mostly care is to have a deep sound in my room, so the Kronos ambient, textures programs and combos can fill the space, create an atmosphere" then studio monitors might not be your best bet. For this purpose you can get a decent set of consumer grade speakers that should do the trick (depending on the size of your room). For the "deep" part of your statement you will need to move a lot of air and that requires a good sized woofer. There is no substitute for displacement when trying to produce "deep" bass. look for 8" or more. I don't buy anything less than 12" which generally gets you down to an honest 20hz or slightly below.
If your goal later is to make your mixes sound better, you can get a pair of mons later, and keep your consumer grade speakers for reference. Nobody can really recommend monitors to you; they are going to be a personal journey of discovery, frustration, and elation. Generally speaking, you get what you pay for in monitorland. I personally believe you should spend the biggest part of your budget on your mons. They are the only thing in your signal chain that actually interact with your ears.
Regarding passive/active, 30 years ago I was a passive purist. Of course, they were the majority of what was available. I'm talking about the big ones, JBL 4425s, altecs, etc. But I've come to prefer the actives, and here's why. The amps in active monitors are custom designed for those monitors, which increases efficiency and reduces price. Also, some actives are actually going to be bi-amped, which is going to be (IMO) significantly more bang for the buck than upgrading your standalone amp at some point. Again, in my opinion, amps are not a very good bank for the buck upgrade. For example, spending $600 on room treatment instead of a new amp is going to get you about 10x the value for your dollar in terms of getting great sound.
Good luck!
I am by no means an expert, but just a couple of things:
First, let me pile onto everything Chris Duncan said above, well put.
If you "mostly care is to have a deep sound in my room, so the Kronos ambient, textures programs and combos can fill the space, create an atmosphere" then studio monitors might not be your best bet. For this purpose you can get a decent set of consumer grade speakers that should do the trick (depending on the size of your room). For the "deep" part of your statement you will need to move a lot of air and that requires a good sized woofer. There is no substitute for displacement when trying to produce "deep" bass. look for 8" or more. I don't buy anything less than 12" which generally gets you down to an honest 20hz or slightly below.
If your goal later is to make your mixes sound better, you can get a pair of mons later, and keep your consumer grade speakers for reference. Nobody can really recommend monitors to you; they are going to be a personal journey of discovery, frustration, and elation. Generally speaking, you get what you pay for in monitorland. I personally believe you should spend the biggest part of your budget on your mons. They are the only thing in your signal chain that actually interact with your ears.
Regarding passive/active, 30 years ago I was a passive purist. Of course, they were the majority of what was available. I'm talking about the big ones, JBL 4425s, altecs, etc. But I've come to prefer the actives, and here's why. The amps in active monitors are custom designed for those monitors, which increases efficiency and reduces price. Also, some actives are actually going to be bi-amped, which is going to be (IMO) significantly more bang for the buck than upgrading your standalone amp at some point. Again, in my opinion, amps are not a very good bank for the buck upgrade. For example, spending $600 on room treatment instead of a new amp is going to get you about 10x the value for your dollar in terms of getting great sound.
Good luck!
Satori wrote:Hello guys,
First of all, let me say how much I like this forum. There's always so much knowledge and good natured communication compared to other places where I'm searching for relative information.
So, this is my question. I have a Kronos. For so much time I was only using headphones and playing in studios. Now, I am about to buy a couple of studio monitors for home. Mainly, to play my Kronos and to make some recordings (driver recordings, tests, amateur stuff that I will later take to a professional to do the normal recording).
What I mostly care is to have a deep sound in my room, so the Kronos ambient, textures programs and combos can fill the space, create an atmosphere. I am sure you know what I'm talking about.
I would appreciate your insight and personal experience a lot. I have narrowed down my search to these:
- Yamaha HS-7: They are a bit more expensive and they have a very flat sound which is great for recording but not so great to just listen to music? You tell me if you know.
- JBL 306p: I've been hearing that they are the best in sound quality, a bit better than the Yamaha although less flat. BUT all of them come with a hissing sound, even when nothing plays. Some people hate it, others ignore it completely.
- Kali Audio LP-6: I haven't read a lot, but they are always up there with the other good monitors of that level.
Thank you in advance
I just want to "close" the thread by saying that I bought the JBL 308p after all. They are amazing, the sound is so clear!
After so many years with headphones and PC speakers, I now get the feeling "my god, what kind of music have I been listening to for so many years?".
Thank you all again for your replies
After so many years with headphones and PC speakers, I now get the feeling "my god, what kind of music have I been listening to for so many years?".
Thank you all again for your replies
I’ve been a huge fan of JBL products for decades, and I’ve never been disappointed.....enjoy!Satori wrote:I just want to "close" the thread by saying that I bought the JBL 308p after all. They are amazing, the sound is so clear!
After so many years with headphones and PC speakers, I now get the feeling "my god, what kind of music have I been listening to for so many years?".
Thank you all again for your replies
Kronos2-61..(2) Triton Classic, Nautilus, Electro 6, Nord Stage 2, Previously owned lots of other gear dating back to the 70’s.
Congrats and enjoy. I am a big JBL fan. Used them for many years.
Satori wrote:I just want to "close" the thread by saying that I bought the JBL 308p after all. They are amazing, the sound is so clear!
After so many years with headphones and PC speakers, I now get the feeling "my god, what kind of music have I been listening to for so many years?".
Thank you all again for your replies