Keyboard sets don't work as you'd expect...

[pax-eterna.1]

So, three times now I have created this default keyboard set. It is saved in the User library, and saved with a user style.

When I load any other style, and then try to load the created and saved keyboard set, it either doesn't load properly (I get the left hand sound but nothing else), or it only loads whatever was assigned to the number 1 button. The other three stay as they were when the style was loaded.

Whether using the touchscreen or the buttons, none of the other 3 ever come up. They only come up when I select the user style saved.

So how the hell does one use these things when you cannot even reload ones you have saved as they were created??!!

Is everything so focussed around styles now with this new OS?

And please do NOT tell me to create a songbook entry!! This is something that should work as a resource to load.

[pax-eterna.1]

Anyone have an idea on how these can work in the way I need?

[AntonySharmman]

I see you often complaining about KBD Set combination that is working properly in any Pa5X OS.
Describe your work flow of creating 2-3 Upper & Lower combinations and how you save them in Style & User KBD Set Bank.

For instance , while on any Style , you click on 3 upper sounds & lower and select the sounds you want , enable ON/OFF 4 switches
of patches you want to hear , adjust Split/Volumes/FX Send/EQ etc and then form upper screen scroll down menu you select save
KBD Set to User Library or in one of 4 KBD SETs of Style.

Now if saved to User KBD Set Bank , every time you select this KBD Set , all 4 SOUNDs combination will be loaded as when saved
no matter of what was the preset KBD SET of a Style that is temporary overwritten.

[pax-eterna.1]

I see you often complaining about KBD Set combination that is working properly in any Pa5X OS.
Describe your work flow of creating 2-3 Upper & Lower combinations and how you save them in Style & User KBD Set Bank.

For instance , while on any Style , you click on 3 upper sounds & lower and select the sounds you want , enable ON/OFF 4 switches
of patches you want to hear , adjust Split/Volumes/FX Send/EQ etc and then form upper screen scroll down menu you select save
KBD Set to User Library or in one of 4 KBD SETs of Style.

Now if saved to User KBD Set Bank , every time you select this KBD Set , all 4 SOUNDs combination will be loaded as when saved.

Firstly it is not often it was twice - this time and one before...please do not put words where there are none! Secondly after your explanation on the previous I thought i had it figured, but no so hence this second thread.

I do thank you for your help it is appreciated.

Ok, so I create the initial setup.. Split on, bass assigned to left, and a sound assigned to upper 1, cool, save that as a keyboard set all good...then I (using that same initial set), assign a different sound to upper 1, all else remains the same - I then save the set with that combination now assigned to button 2, rinse and repeat for a new sound on upper 1 for button 3 and again for 4.

So that is all done I re-save the set as a default set under my user banks. I assign that to a user style then save the user style with that set.

Now if I load another style, and then try to use that created keyboard set (with StyleToKybSet on or off, makes no difference), it does not load (as described in the OP) and indeed if I load the saved user style with that keyboard set, it ONLY loads whatever is assigned to slot 1 to button 1, - not the other four button setups as saved in the original keyboard set.

My understanding (and iirc as it was on the pa4 and earlier) you could load an use any saved keyboard set with any style and the keyboard set would load as saved. Obviously I have misunderstood something in the manual.

It seems everything on the PA5 is "styles-centric" IE it all revolves around a style rather than a user creating unique performance setups.

[pax-eterna.1]

Qui has a YT vid on keyboard sets iirc, I will go and have another look at that and see if I have missed something.

[pax-eterna.1]

So, workaround, is to create styles that are not styles, but keyboard performance setups.

The four setups load when the user style is loaded, but at no other time, so I'll just create a setup and name it that instead of a "style name" in a user style bank, probably named to live performance setups or something.

It does seem very likely that in the change to the OS Korg have made everything center around the style...One cannot recall a full (IE all four buttons) user keyboard set at random. Which is odd, as it seems all the factory styles change all four when the factory style is loaded.

At least that is my experience so far.

[AntonySharmman]

I'm in difficulty to understand your real problem there ...

If you use a KBD SET base like Lower Pad , Strings,Piano & Flute and save it at User KBD SET Bank as Combi1 , next time you will
use it and you just change only flute with sax and save it as Combi2 , the other three sounds Lower Pad , Strings & Piano will be the same
when you'll recall Combi2.
If you change all 3 Upper & Lower sounds and save KBD SET at User Bank then when you'll recall this KBD Set you will see all changed.

Bear in mind that every Style has 4 KBD SET of 4 Sounds , and if you recall one from user bank it replaces temporary the 1st one and
if you press any 1-4 Style preset KBD Sets then the written KBD Set will come up again.

That's why you save 4 custom KBD SET in a style , for case you need them for direct access !


Hope this helps

[pax-eterna.1]

I'm in difficulty to understand your real problem there ...

If you use a KBD SET base like Lower Pad , Strings,Piano & Flute and save it at User KBD SET Bank as Combi1 , next time you will
use it and you just change only flute with sax and save it as Combi2 , the other three sounds Lower Pad , Strings & Piano will be the same
when you'll recall Combi2.
If you change all 3 Upper & Lower sounds and save KBD SET at User Bank then when you'll recall this KBD Set you will see all changed.

Bear in mind that every Style has 4 KBD SET of 4 Sounds , and if you recall one from user bank it replaces temporary the 1st one and
if you press any 1-4 Style preset KBD Sets then the written KBD Set will come up again.

That's why you save 4 custom KBD SET in a style , for case you need them for direct access !


Hope this helps

Nope sorry, you don't get what I am after. I know that saving 3 upper and one .lower saves fine and loads fine.

And no the written ones do not come up again...the buttons 2.3.4. stay as whatever was previously loaded (reason is below) My keyboard set consists of ALL four buttons and I expected all four to load when a keyboard set is loaded.

If I could post pictures here, you'd see..

Because under the save keyboard set, when you save to a style, all you can do is save ONE slot, not to ALL as you can with a Songbook save.
To do it I would need to keep reloading the style (with my keyboard set locked), and then re-save four times to get all four into the user style slots.

For some reason Korg have left out the ALL option they have on a Songbook save menu when saving a keyboard set to a style.

[laurentm6]

Hi, I guess you selected well the "style to kbdset" function, to change the kbdset with style variation ? (button should blink)

[AntonySharmman]

Now I've got of what you mean ...
KBD SET is a sound combination by definition , its the way you select a solo instrument , a piano/a lead synth/ a guitar
nothing to do with Style contents.
On the other hand a Style can host 4 STS/KBD SET sound combinations that can be saved with style.
It's completely useless to load 4 combinations of 4 KBD SETs when loading only one , this is not library anymore
but specific function that you would like to exist.

You already have 4 Preset Sound combinations in every style and using a saved KBD SET , you get the option to use in
real time a 5th sound combination that you might need at that time.
Creating your own 11 Favorite custom KBD SETs that you usually need , you have the option to select 4+11= 15 KBD
SET sounds per Style.
This is the way STS/KBD SET/Combination library works in any arranger AFAIK.

Hope this helps

[mstodola]

This is all too confusing to me.

[QuiRobinez]

This is all too confusing to me.

I agree, a quite simple concept is made very complex.

It's so easy to grasp once you understand what a keyboard set is. Antony explains it correctly. But to make it really clear:

Style keyboard sets
On your hardware pa5x you see 4 hardware buttons below the touchscreen labeled 1-4 with the word KEYBOARD SET beneath it.

That means that there you can 4 different keyboard sets, so each number can contain 1 keyboard set.

1 keyboard set (4 sounds)
Below the silver dial knob you see a section called KEYBOARD, there are four buttons labeled:
Upper 1, 2, 3 and lower

In that section you program ONE keyboard set.

Conclusion
That is basically all there is to it, it's the same as on the pa4x.

Now when you setup a style, you can add four different keyboard sets to a style. This can not be done in factory styles, these are protected, but you can save it as a user style.

To add a keyboard set to one of four keyboard sets numbers the user styles, just select right top menu and then save keyboard set. Select to style in that popup windows and at the right bottom you can select which hardware button you want to save that keyboard set to in that style. There is no need to save the style. That is done automatically.

Simplified summary:
- A keyboard set is a selection of 4 sounds from the sound category
- A style uses 4 keyboard sets
- A songbook registration always store the active keyboard set in the hardware button keyboard set number 1, the other 3 keyboard sets are from the original style (keyboard set 2, 3 and 4)

* or just watch my keyboard sets tutorial on youtube.

[pax-eterna.1]

None of you get it...ALL of that I know!!

Here is a link to a video on Dropbox - hope that explains it better:

https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/16nyxits ... oirnq&dl=0

The issue is that when I have created ALL four of the sets and then save them, they do not re-load as saved!!

It's not confusing at all!

Further, When saving a style you can only choose to save one keyboard set slot, When saving to a Songbook you can save ALL four at once.

When I save this said scenario as a songbook entry it all works as expected all four of the user prepared slots reload, when I load a style the keyboard set was saved with it ONLY loads slot one! If (under the style save menu) I save to say slot 2, then only slot 2 is reloaded, slot one stays as whatever it was.

IIRC, on the PA1.2.3 a saved Keybed set reloaded exactly as saved no matter what mode you were in (apart from sound)

So for an example, I load a style, but I want my OWN keyboard set of four, not the ones in the style, I then go to the Keyboard set library and choose one, however as I have repeatedly said it does not load all four it just loads 1 - all four WERE created and then saved!

I might do a video and post a link

EDIT: at the end of video where I said it doesn't work, I actually meant doesn't work as expected...IE if I select a user keyboard set I would have expected that that keyboard set in its entirety would load. It probably works as Korg have programmed it I assume.

[NETWORK1]

AHHH ................now i see what you mean
Great explanation-Vid

[pax-eterna.1]

So my "work-around" is to create the keyboard set, then save that whole thing as a "pseudo-style".

When I want to use that full keyboard set I load that "style" freeze (or lock) the keyboard set, load the style I want to use/edit/create and then save each of the four combos to the four slots, which is to say I need to save four times to the four slots - viz, select button one, save that to kbset 1, select button 2, save to kbset2 and so on - and THEN a final style save.

That's the only way that works.