EXTERNAL & INTERNAL CONTROL @SAME TIME

apex · Post by **apex** » Wed Apr 24, 2013 12:47 am

Dniss wrote:Ok. sorry I'm not to good to explain midi stuff.

Let me start by asking you this:

In your device, say you want to control the first strip volume slider, is the midi command:

CC-007 CH:1

Then the second strip volume slider:

CC-007, CH:2

and so on?

it's a software program. and the "real" way it should be done is to just use CC messages. That way they don't interfere with each other.

and this is VERY possible to do with the Kronos. but you have to use external mode. once you swith to external mode you have no control over the internal sounds.... (not yet at least... but I believe we will come up with something)

the program is set up to receive midi messages globally (on one midi channel) (as far as the cc message) but you can send messages to individual channels as well... just having to dig a bit deeper into the software than has obviously been done before. I've been emailing support back and forth for the last 2 or 3 days and from their reaction to the questions and the way the help is going, they've not had this situation presented to them before.

Dniss · Post by **Dniss** » Wed Apr 24, 2013 12:51 am

Let me try again. I'm not in front of the K, I hope this is accurate:

Each strip in my external device uses the command CC-007 ch: (strip number) to control its volume slider. So say I want to control the first stip volume, I have to use command CC-007 CH:01 to control it.

Since I have instruments in my device on strip 1 to 4, I know I will require midi channel 1 to 4 to be free on my kronos so I can use those channels later to control these volumes on the device.

So what I start by doing, since I have instuments on my first 5 strips in the kronos, is changing their midi channel to something remote, like channel 12.

Then I take strip 12 in the kronos and set it as EXT ch:12. It's now sending on channel 12 so my internal timbers are responding on channel 12.

Now channel 1,2,3,4 are free for other stuff: controlling those remote volume strips.

In the K, I take strip 6 (or track 6) and set it as EXT ch:1. When I move that slider (#6) it controls the device first strip.

I then set strip 7 in the Kronos (or track 7) to EXT ch:2. Now I can control the device second volume strip.

And so on.

I hope this is clearer.

Regards,

Dniss · Post by **Dniss** » Wed Apr 24, 2013 12:54 am

apex wrote:it's a software program. and the "real" way it should be done is to just use CC messages.

Yes I know. The Kronos sliders sends CC-007 message on their own even when the K is set to internal. I don't set the Kronos the External at all.

btw I'm giving you a tip to control volume sliders only, I thought this is what you were looking for. Of course, if you want a complete set of extermal cc, than obviously you have to setup the surface to external.

apex · Post by **apex** » Wed Apr 24, 2013 1:02 am

Dniss wrote:
Now channel 1,2,3,4 are free for other stuff: controlling those remote volume strips.

In the K, I take strip 6 (or track 6) and set it as EXT ch:1. When I move that slider (#6) it controls the device first strip.

I then set strip 7 in the Kronos (or track 7) to EXT ch:2. Now I can control the device second volume strip.

right!!! This is the perfect solution. I've explained it in this way to the software support too...

this is the obvious solution. AND I sooooo wish that it would work. but the program is receiving those cc07 messages all on the same midi channel. even though the kronos is sending them on the channel specified on the Kronos AND the channel strip in the software is set to receive midi message on a specific channel.

when I set the first fader on the Kronos to send cc07 (the default cc message when the kronos control surface is in track/mixer mode) and then I "midi learn" and attach the fader from the Kronos to the control of the channel volume in the software. COOL!!! Everything works...

now when I go to do the exact same thing with the 2nd fader and move it... guess what happens. all the channel strip(s) previously assigned also move. WHY? because the software (for some reason) is receiving midi cc07 on the same midi channel...even though the midi channel in the Kronos is sending the cc message on different midi channels.

Dniss · Post by **Dniss** » Wed Apr 24, 2013 1:09 am

Humm that is strange. Here it's working.

My device is setup to receive on a different channel too. All other assignments will require to be sent on that channel, all, but the mixer itself which only respond to specific midi channel as I described.

Sorry, I thought every software mixer were setup that way.

Dniss · Post by **Dniss** » Wed Apr 24, 2013 1:13 am

apex wrote:but the program is receiving those cc07 messages all on the same midi channel. even though the kronos is sending them on the channel specified on the Kronos AND the channel strip in the software is set to receive midi message on a specific channel.

Is it me or this is not making much sense?

How can each of strip in the software set to receive midi message on a specific channel if you only receive on one channel?

apex · Post by **apex** » Wed Apr 24, 2013 1:35 am

Dniss wrote:
apex wrote:but the program is receiving those cc07 messages all on the same midi channel. even though the kronos is sending them on the channel specified on the Kronos AND the channel strip in the software is set to receive midi message on a specific channel.
Is it me or this is not making much sense?

How can each of strip in the software set to receive midi message on a specific channel if you only receive on one channel?

That's kinda the same question I'm asking.... its like the strips can receive the triggering of note Data on the individual channels....but cc messages etc are received overall (globally)

apex · Post by **apex** » Wed Apr 24, 2013 2:54 am

right now the best thing that I've come up with is a combination of two or so ideas that have come from this thread

unless the RAX software support agent and myself can figure out something else... it's got to be possible within the software, just may take some digging.

anyway, as of now what I plan to do is to:

1) switch back and forth between the two control surface modes
(timbre/track and external)
2) assign faders 1-4 (or so) for the Kronos and then faders 5-8 will be for external mode.

this will stop me from having to remember which faders are which and just having to pay attention to which mode i'm in. as stated before not tooooo much tweaking of the mix is actually going on during a live situation (you pretty much set it and forget it... maybe some minor stuff here and there)

but hopefully they are able to instruct me how to make the individual midi channels only respond and send messages on their channels.

apex · Post by **apex** » Thu Apr 25, 2013 4:26 pm

just an update... but the support agent and I pretty much concluded that it's not going to be possible to do what I'm trying to do by using the software...

so.... it's up to the Kronos or some other outside midi control source.

so the guys that were suggesting using the iPad... let's here what you got!!!!

I've been looking at a few different ipad control surface apps, but there are quite a few out there.