Kaoss or not to Kaoss

Dragan · Post by **Dragan** » Tue Dec 01, 2015 8:10 pm

Hello Kaoss users,

My current setup has 3 live instruments (MicroBrute, Volca Bass & Volca Keys), multieffect (Zoom G3) and sampler (Akai MPX16). I run drumloops from MPX and then layer sequences from Volcas, on top of that comes the MicroBrute.

I figure a Kaoss device could render my two separate devices (sampler & multieffect) obsolete. But would it give me more (or similar) control range & new flexibility? I have no idea since I don't own a Kaoss device (yet).

I even don't know which Kaoss device would be best to fit my rig. Kaoss Pad Mini 2S or Kaossilator 2S? Kaoss Pad 3+ or Kaossilator Pro+? Maybe two of them in combination? Any thoughts & ideas are very welcome.

Cheers, D

Spheric El · Post by **Spheric El** » Thu Dec 10, 2015 7:21 pm

Mini KP2 is very nice.Good for volcas as is mini jacks .Effects are better to.
I have one.Also I own 2 KP3s and 2 KPmini originals.There all good.
I like lots of effects chained to create unique sounds, so I wouldn't consider making machines redundant.
I find KPs expressive for thumping in elements (with decks,loops and synths).

Dragan · Post by **Dragan** » Thu Dec 10, 2015 7:40 pm

Spheric El wrote:Mini KP2 is very nice.Good for volcas as is mini jacks .Effects are better to.
I have one.Also I own 2 KP3s and 2 KPmini originals.There all good.
I like lots of effects chained to create unique sounds, so I wouldn't consider making machines redundant.
I find KPs expressive for thumping in elements (with decks,loops and synths).

Hello Spheric El,
I have some questions

1. Did you mean chain like several kaoss-devices together? Or did you mean several sorts of effects from a single unit?

2. How many effects can such a mini device deliver at once?

3. Whats the benefit of having the bigger device?

4. Is editor software available with more precise control?

Thanks for replying!

Spheric El · Post by **Spheric El** » Thu Dec 10, 2015 8:37 pm

Hi Dragan.
1 yes to chaining several.I like two parallel chains so signal can have a combo of how I feel.One KP can only select one effect program at a time.Some of these progs will contain two effects (like lowpass looper).KP3s can resample so samples can be multi effects.
2 see above.
3 KP3 and 3+ sample.4 loop banks of excellent playability with one shot business or pad triggers -very nice and tactile.Unique.Slight problem with syncing to midiclock over long periods.Apart from that -the best sample technique I've come across for loops anyway.
Also motion sequence will record finger swipes then repeat and this creates auto chaos evolution.Nice.
More buttons generally for quicker access of features that require more fiddling about on smaller models.More memory buttons for fast recall of ptograms.A better release effect.A light for position and a larger pad.
4 not really but it is midi controllable so any DAW or midi seq will be able to edit it for programmable control.It takes CCs for its XY axis and button presses.
The edited software is more a librarian type archiving for samples and program setups plus CC config.

Dragan · Post by **Dragan** » Sat Dec 12, 2015 8:10 am

Hey Spheric El,

1+2) Zoom G3 which I'm currently using can chain 6 effects simultaneous. These are guitar oriented FX but the delays & reverbs and some others are pretty neat for upgrading live analog sounds.

2) Only the looper function on G3 is quite basic, doesn't give me much flexibility. I was planing to solve this glitch with the Akai MPX16, yet this one is best for controlled sampling, not so much for spontaneous looping & improvisation. I think in this field Kaoss would give me most benefit & open new possibilities, don't you think?

3) Librarian will be fine to make sense in the loops archiving.

Kaoss begins to clear out thanks to your replies!

Spheric El · Post by **Spheric El** » Sat Dec 12, 2015 11:14 am

Good Stuff

You asked about KaOscillator ..I would go for KP3 deffo over KO pro but would consider a mini KO, even original is very good,different- more simplified and just good compared to KO2.The KP mini 2 is brilliant and not nessesseraly worse than +s but I'm not sure as I don't own +,but i thinks theres not much different-sampler or mp3player.The mini 2 for both KP and KO are mini jacks as opposed to phono which I find a big consideration for where it sits in your set up.Phonos I prefare but some gear is all mini jacks (Volca) so it depends what and where I'm using it (some gear is in my bag and on the go-mini jacks,other is turntable based bedroom stuff-Phonos so v1 KPs mini and KP3s).
KP3 sample loops do have a slight drift problem against midi clock with external gear sync.This may or may not be a problem for you but you can always resample to your other sampler.The KP3 is a blast all the same.this would be the same on the KO pro too.

Spheric El · Post by **Spheric El** » Sun Dec 13, 2015 6:15 am

Dragan PM'd me asking about what gear I use.Ive printed it here incase of interest to anyone.

Instruments..well,
I use the two KP3s.As said these are great for their 8 loop banks alone.But they are both fed via a DJ mixer(at mo I'm using a fairly cheap Studiomaster Fusion).This mixer is fed by decks and also my main,other mixer,a Yamaha O1v.An excellent digital thing.Back to the KP3s-my signal can go leave DJ mixer into either KP3.These are both connected to a mini KP each, which is then connected to an old 90s multi effect,mainly for classy reverbs (Lexicon Reflex and Boss SX-700).Foot switches to bypass -so lots of hands on for this pair of effect buses.These two stereo pairs arrive back at the O1v.These two channels can here be phase inverted for great "phase cancellation" when going deep into signal routing.Also side chain compressing/gating by any other instruments connected to this desk.
Synths connected here are
MiniAk as my main 3 octave.
TB3
Volca Keys
Monotribe *2
Old ER-1 (mainly for its ringmod ext input and easy seq for quick motion seq and external instruments ,KP3 samples if I want to sequence.This also has a multi effect strapped on -Behringer Modulizer Pro- so its like another effect buss,with sequenced gate,fed by DJ mixer).
A utility type stereo channel that has laptop ,plus lots of "dinner table gear" ,fed by passive hand made mixer I bought online.
And finally a pair of OP-1s.
These last synth are my most recent direction and are taking most of my attention.I can unplugg one and bust it out on a train journey or trip to cafe/friends.I can also use them as excellent dual 4 tracks being fed from desk.
A lot of the gear has input and both my mixers have lots of outputs.Plenty and plenty of routes .This is specially nice for signal feedback via the two desks and 4 KPs.Proper scifi noises made by no synth.
I also have a Fostex D108 8track digitally linked to 01v and I use a iCM4+ for midi,plus an iPod touch for icm controller and Xynthesizr sequencer.

Dragan · Post by **Dragan** » Mon Dec 14, 2015 7:37 pm

Spheric El wrote:Good Stuff
You asked about KaOscillator ..I would go for KP3 deffo over KO pro but would consider a mini KO, even original is very good,different- more simplified and just good compared to KO2.The KP mini 2 is brilliant and not nessesseraly worse than +s but I'm not sure as I don't own +,but i thinks theres not much different-sampler or mp3player.The mini 2 for both KP and KO are mini jacks as opposed to phono which I find a big consideration for where it sits in your set up.Phonos I prefare but some gear is all mini jacks (Volca) so it depends what and where I'm using it (some gear is in my bag and on the go-mini jacks,other is turntable based bedroom stuff-Phonos so v1 KPs mini and KP3s).
KP3 sample loops do have a slight drift problem against midi clock with external gear sync.This may or may not be a problem for you but you can always resample to your other sampler.The KP3 is a blast all the same.this would be the same on the KO pro too.

Hello Speric El,
Thanks for your extensive replies.

I think the biggest omission on the smaller KP are missinig MIDI-jacks. How do you live with the absence of a display on the fullsize KP? How about sampling time & quality? How do these differ between smaller & fullsize KP?

Spheric El · Post by **Spheric El** » Mon Dec 14, 2015 10:31 pm

Yes I agree.Did I miss that off ? Midi is a nice feature.I use them as excellent controllers.And occasionally trigger the samples via midi.Having said that I do prefer to switch sample loops on and off by hand because they are unique samplers in that they turn samples on half way through playing (as oppossed to starting at beginning of each trigger).But yes,midi opens up a host of uses and different workflows.
The minis I own don't sample as such but can capture a loop with the loop programs.My mini 2 has an MP3 player but no sampler.So I can't comment on KPmini 2s.
The KP3 has,those 4 banks to sample 4bars.This goes down to 74bpm so ends up at 13 seconds about (times 4).Quality of samples I'd discibe as excellent,capable of all sorts of playback and sound generation.My favorite sampler.
Quality seems good on all of them.I havnt compared directly (as I'm hard wired KP3 into mini on both busses and I've had this set like that for years).my decks sound ok through them and my old Reflex creates well more back ground noise.
I was impressed by the changes made to the mini 2 effects though,when compared to KP3/original mini.Nice improvements.
As for display,that's fine.The pad will flash the name of a new selected program.All other functions I found easy to learn and are printed on the buttons with shift functions.I found it all right there when needed.