Long hours programming - Keeping ergonomic?

[enigmahack]

I just wanted to reach out and see how other programmers deal with this issue.

I spend literally over 9 hours a day programming on the Kronos - The problem I'm worried about is entirely of ergonomics. The screen is at an angle which is fine if you're looking down but looking down for hours at a time is starting to strain the back of my neck.

Before you suggest trying the Korg remote tools - They're slow, they desync, you can't access disk mode, and while I tried for about a week to use them, they're very very clunky and simply don't give me the control and response I desire.

I do use PCG Tools a LOT, and I'm thankful for that (Organising setlists and so on) and I have done as much as I can to put as much control into the PC side of things. I have a Kronos that is more or less permanently tethered to my PC via USB, Ethernet, you name it.

I'm just curious how you other guys/gals approach it. There's no actual remote-control software, no VNC/Terminal services/remote control app that actually remotely controls the actual screen, just the sysex dump which is slow and clunky in 2017.

Ideas/suggestions?

[GregC]

I just wanted to reach out and see how other programmers deal with this issue.

I spend literally over 9 hours a day programming on the Kronos - The problem I'm worried about is entirely of ergonomics. The screen is at an angle which is fine if you're looking down but looking down for hours at a time is starting to strain the back of my neck.


Ideas/suggestions?

9 hours is very intense. I sure wish I was 20 yrs old

Anyway, with my MBP, I also use it in closed display mode. I route the video ( thunderbolt) to a 21" monitor. The 21" is at shoulder height when I am playing the Kronos. I prefer that view angle.

I also take a break every hour. Walk around the house, chase the cats, go outside for a few minutes. If I don't take a break, fatigue sets in, and I am not as productive. Strong coffee also revives me.

[KK]

When I bought mine last October, I rapidly decided to try different tilt angles. For practice, the KK is flat for optimal keyboard angle. For intensive programming sessions though (which don't happen too often as I don't have much time), I place a home-made wooden platform under the KK. Simply cut three little triangles of wood that you insert on the sides and middle of a flat wooden board. It's certainly not the most practical thing to do, but it's an inexpensive solution. YMMV

[amit]

I hear you, am going through the same but in a different way.
There ain't no solution, but to place kronos in Standing/vertical/diagonal position and up high, for easier screen access, along with a remote screen with pc editor on one side and a midi controller keyboard.
it's not ideal, but that is is what i'd do other than making my chair as comfortable as possible. I stopped using mouse few years back and only use Large trackballs that helps a bit too.

I've been lately spending long hours programming(coding) and I keep changing positions or move from my desktop to laptop (remote desktop) and different places etc. Its still very tiring (12-15 hours), but bit easier on the back and neck.

Another trick is to try some pieces of mirror if you have lying around into some cardboard box placed at such angles that they reflect/invert and project same image in front, or just use a webcam mounted on flex arm, sending images to display in front,, but you will still need to reach kronos screen for interacting.

[enigmahack]

Thanks for the suggestions everyone...

I've seriously thought about the 'old school overhead projector' route, but it hadn't dawned on me that I might just put it at an angle.

Greg - I definitely try to get up and walk around every couple hours - my ears get fatigued as well and coming back fresh helps me realise that I was off the mark on that last sound (whatever it was) so yeah. Frequent breaks are definitely useful.

I do like the idea of having the Kronos on an angle - it would definitely reduce the fatigue and I'm not practising on it - I'm just programming sounds.

I'll try the angle thing, and see if that helps. I had considered the webcam idea but I'd still have to be looking at the screen to see where I'm pressing and so on.

I just wish Korg would have a VGA port or HDMI port on the back to allow direct visual access. One of the many wishes

[GregC]

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I just wish Korg would have a VGA port or HDMI port on the back to allow direct visual access. One of the many wishes

this is 1 of the most requested. A VGA is definitely old tech.

Being curious, does the touch LCD ( connections etc) somehow conflict with a HDMI out ? Or is a video card necessary for HDMI ?

Or is it more software/OS and running a cable off the mobo ?

[enigmahack]

T

I just wish Korg would have a VGA port or HDMI port on the back to allow direct visual access. One of the many wishes

this is 1 of the most requested. A VGA is definitely old tech.

Being curious, does the touch LCD ( connections etc) somehow conflict with a HDMI out ? Or is a video card necessary for HDMI ?

Or is it more software/OS and running a cable off the mobo ?

\

From my understanding, it's more of a secondary output, but there's some sort of encryption or... something. I remember reading a bunch about it with the dude that hacked the OS.

In the OASYS, you could plug into the VGA port on the motherboard and it was like a dual-screen (duplicate) setup.

When you put a connection into the VGA port on the Kronos however, it only shows basic OS data. The majority of the actual output isn't VESA, and is going through the digitizer from my memory.

Yes, from a software aspect it's definitely possible to have the output go through the VGA or some sort of dongle, but because of how Korg has configured the video out...

How I beg for a higher resolution user-clickable interface on my PC that is tied directly to the hardware of the Kronos.

[aron]

I haven't tried this, but consider watchmakers. They need to work all day and not hurt their back etc...

They have the watch fairly high and look down at the movement.

I have no idea but thought I'd throw it out there.
http://www.ottofrei.com/Store/Watchmaker-Benches/

[EJ2]

I can certainly empathize with you. Long hours of programming can seem like an "addiction" - once you get locked into just one more parameter tweak etc., it is difficult to let it go and take reasonable breaks, not just for refreshing your creativity, but also.....your health. For me, before the advent of the M3 and Kronos software editor, it was nuts, really nuts. However, even with the help of an editor, or ergonomic arrangements, it's still nuts and I think all serious programmers and developers struggle with a sensible structure of work and rest. If your ass or your neck and shoulders are telling you to get up and go for a walk, do it. Yet, I know from my own experience developing KARMA-fied combinations, it's that "one more tweak" that holds me in a pattern that is difficult to break. Discipline and a good timer works....sometimes. If that timer happens to be a partner, listen to her/him.

[danmusician]

This is a fascinating discussion. Up until now, I've been mostly a "preset" user of my Kronos. Other than a few tweaks here and there, I've done very little in the way of programing. I did add my own sampled instrument and I've imported sequences from my DAW.

In June, I'll be retiring from teaching. I'm really looking forward to spending time in my home studio. I want to dig into KARMA particularly and learn to create my own patterns.

I hadn't thought about the pain of working solely on the Kronos screen. As a trifocal wearer, I find it difficult to work with.

I may try a magnifier like this: - http://a.co/dg8xTKV

I think I can clip on a mic boom and position it where I want and move it out of the way when not needed.

Has anyone else tries a mounted magnifier. Any recommendations?

[voip]

The sample images from the magnifier that danmusician mentioned suggest the image isn't going to be crisp to the edges, which may not be a real limitation, and for $10 is definitely worth a try. There are smartphone apps for helping partially sighted folk, basically using the smartphone camera and presenting a magnified image on the smartphone screen e.g. Visor, which is a free app for Android and iOS phones. I just put on a pair of +1.5 dioptre el-cheapo monofocal reading glasses for detailed editing on the Kronos.

.

[GregC]

This is a fascinating discussion. Up until now, I've been mostly a "preset" user of my Kronos. Other than a few tweaks here and there, I've done very little in the way of programing. I did add my own sampled instrument and I've imported sequences from my DAW.

In June, I'll be retiring from teaching. I'm really looking forward to spending time in my home studio. I want to dig into KARMA particularly and learn to create my own patterns.

I hadn't thought about the pain of working solely on the Kronos screen. As a trifocal wearer, I find it difficult to work with.

I may try a magnifier like this: - http://a.co/dg8xTKV

?

I have 1 and I think its useless. TO move it out of the way for LCD entry is annoying

[danmusician]

I have 1 and I think its useless. TO move it out of the way for LCD entry is annoying

My hope is to mount it that I can reach under it for LCD entry. It would help my eyes to see my finger under the magnifier to be sure I'm hitting the right area of the LCD.

[GregC]

I have 1 and I think its useless. TO move it out of the way for LCD entry is annoying

My hope is to mount it that I can reach under it for LCD entry. It would help my eyes to see my finger under the magnifier to be sure I'm hitting the right area of the LCD.

you might experiment with a similar piece of glass and experiment/see what diffraction and distortion there is

mounting it with ' x inches ' of crawl space sounds tricky

[KK]

I do like the idea of having the Kronos on an angle - it would definitely reduce the fatigue and I'm not practising on it - I'm just programming sounds.

I'll try the angle thing, and see if that helps.

Here's my inexpensive solution... Cut three little things like this and place (or attach) them under a flat wooden board. Certainly not the ideal solution, but it's worth a try.