How to achieve certain sounds?

Edhardt · Post by **Edhardt** » Mon Mar 16, 2009 11:01 pm

Hi, I'm wondering if anybody has any tips to achieve a certain sound that I've been looking for, but I have been unable to get it! (I'm using a Korg R3). I've been tweaking and nothing seems to get it quite right. I'm looking for a lead sound, but something not so sharp, but "electronic" sounding, if that makes any sense. Something like the synth used in this band (http://music.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuse ... 40238&ap=0 Listen to the song "Party Foul", track 5 and "Dr. Shavargo Pt 3", track 10) It's kind of "generic" sounding synth I'd say; I have it in alot of my soft synths (If you have Pro-53 by Native Instruments, program 127 "Mega Dance" is exactly what I'd like, just in my R3!)

If anybody has any tips, or if anyone knows of any other sites that has Korg R3 patches available for download, other than the download section of this site, if you could share them with me, that would be greatly appreciated!

One last thing, I currently run (For live) my R3 through an old Fender Twin Reverb amp. Is there any big downside to running a synth through a guitar amp? And would it be better to run it through a PA system? What difference would a keyboard amp make? I haven't noticed anything wrong with running it through that amp.

Thank you for any suggestions

X-Trade · Post by **X-Trade** » Tue Mar 17, 2009 12:34 am

if you have a similar program on the pro-53, can't you look at the settings for that? (e.g. what waveforms are used, if oscillators are detuned... is resonance high? etc).

regarding the speakers, I would certainly recommend going through the PA. although going through an amp is useful particularly for certain lead sounds...

Basically a guitar amp is designed to emphasise particular regions in a guitar sound.. they also add a lot of distortion, even on 'clean' settings, as I said they are designed to make a guitar sound good (electric guitar clean through a PA would often sound awful), whereas a keyboard amp is designed mainly for hearing yourself on stage, and in practise, not so much for getting the audience to hear you. the main difference between that and a guitar amplifier is that a keyboard amplifier is a clean amp - in that it adds no distortion or has any directly noticible effect on the sound - it is more like a PA or home cinema system in that it is supposed to faithfully reproduce the input, instead of adding its own character to the sound.

and unless you are using two amps, you won't get anything in stereo. a lot of sounds can have panning effects or subtle phase differences between the left and right to give the sound more width. chorus, reverb, etc particularly benefit from this!

classic analogue synths were often run through guitar amps because there was nothing else, and it does give it a characteristic sound but mostly useful for mono lead sounds or electric pianos and organs - but you can choose to have that plus the option to turning it off by using the amp simulator effects in the R3. so you have more flexibility in being able to choose whether a sound will be clean or distorted using the effects if you are going clean through PA or Keyboard Amp (or both!!) rather than forcing you to always have distorted sound through the amp your are using.

Edhardt · Post by **Edhardt** » Tue Mar 17, 2009 11:42 pm

For the speakers, do you mean run it through the venue's PA system, like through a directbox and into the venue, or use my own PA? If it shared the PA with the vocals, would it interfere?

Thanks for the tips, by the way, much appreciated

JaymzDestroy · Post by **JaymzDestroy** » Thu Mar 19, 2009 11:03 pm

Well I would defo take Xtrade's advice and have a look at the Soft Synth settings and try and recreate them on the R3

But I wouldnt use the Fender Twin for the R3. The Amp is meant to handle the frequencies which electric guitars give out and Bass sounds on the R3 could ruin the Amp through time, as they are obviously a lot lower.

I would defo use the PA or even a designated keyboard Amp, which is designed to handle the High and Low Frequencies which the R3 gives out

Edhardt · Post by **Edhardt** » Fri Mar 20, 2009 1:59 am

JaymzDestroy wrote:Well I would defo take Xtrade's advice and have a look at the Soft Synth settings and try and recreate them on the R3

But I wouldnt use the Fender Twin for the R3. The Amp is meant to handle the frequencies which electric guitars give out and Bass sounds on the R3 could ruin the Amp through time, as they are obviously a lot lower.

I would defo use the PA or even a designated keyboard Amp, which is designed to handle the High and Low Frequencies which the R3 gives out

Thanks, i'm giving it a shot. But if i use the venue PA and they dont have moniters i wont be able to hear myself

X-Trade · Post by **X-Trade** » Fri Mar 20, 2009 5:36 am

Edhardt wrote:For the speakers, do you mean run it through the venue's PA system, like through a directbox and into the venue, or use my own PA? If it shared the PA with the vocals, would it interfere?

Thanks for the tips, by the way, much appreciated

yeah, just run it to the venue. you don't need a direct box because keyboards are 'line level', they aren't mics or guitars! they're more like effects processors, mixers etc...
and it won't interfere with the vocals, its just another audio source just like anything else

I run my keyboards through my own small mixer, on top of my keyboard amp - which I use so I and the band can hear myself, but then the output of the mixer can be sent off to the board for the live PA (I actually run earphones off the mixer now as I find the keyboard amp has to face outwards to the rest of the band so that they can hear me...)

anyway you can always get some splitting mixer or something (or use the headphone outputs - not just for headphones!) to drive your own keyboard amp for monitoring, or buy your own floor monitor... its essentially the same as a cheap keyboard amp.

slammah2012 · Post by **slammah2012** » Fri Mar 20, 2009 5:41 am

Well for me, I like switching the oscilators using the Mix fader on the CS80 along with lfo speed on polypressure..... the filters are so important in a sound...

slammah2012 · Post by **slammah2012** » Fri Mar 20, 2009 5:44 am

Edhardt wrote:For the speakers, do you mean run it through the venue's PA system, like through a directbox and into the venue, or use my own PA? If it shared the PA with the vocals, would it interfere?

Thanks for the tips, by the way, much appreciated

The interferance would all depend on the sound man....

Edhardt · Post by **Edhardt** » Fri Mar 20, 2009 7:50 pm

X-Trade wrote: yeah, just run it to the venue. you don't need a direct box because keyboards are 'line level', they aren't mics or guitars! they're more like effects processors, mixers etc...
and it won't interfere with the vocals, its just another audio source just like anything else

I run my keyboards through my own small mixer, on top of my keyboard amp - which I use so I and the band can hear myself, but then the output of the mixer can be sent off to the board for the live PA (I actually run earphones off the mixer now as I find the keyboard amp has to face outwards to the rest of the band so that they can hear me...)

anyway you can always get some splitting mixer or something (or use the headphone outputs - not just for headphones!) to drive your own keyboard amp for monitoring, or buy your own floor monitor... its essentially the same as a cheap keyboard amp.

Yeah I have an Alesis Multimix 8 mixer that I could use like you said, or just run the out's from the keys to the board and the headphones to an amp.

thanks

slammah2012 · Post by **slammah2012** » Sat Mar 21, 2009 7:46 am

yeah, just run it to the venue. you don't need a direct box because keyboards are 'line level', they aren't mics or guitars! they're more like effects processors, mixers etc...
and it won't interfere with the vocals, its just another audio source just like anything else

Whoa.....back up....
Direct boxes are to split the line level unbalanced on your keyboard to 2 paths...a balanced mic level /xlr out to the Snake which feeds FOH and Monitor Consoles,......and the instrument out on the DI goes to your personal instrument amp on stage....

Thats how its done....
If you start messing without balanced lines to a house system, you will be messing with grounds, creating push and pull , RF..., not to mention you dont have separate volume controls for Phones and line out....

Any real venue will have sufficient DI boxes for bass players and Keyboards....Mics plug straight into the snake....

X-Trade · Post by **X-Trade** » Sat Mar 21, 2009 10:58 am

slammah2012 wrote:
yeah, just run it to the venue. you don't need a direct box because keyboards are 'line level', they aren't mics or guitars! they're more like effects processors, mixers etc...
and it won't interfere with the vocals, its just another audio source just like anything else
Whoa.....back up....
Direct boxes are to split the line level unbalanced on your keyboard to 2 paths...a balanced mic level /xlr out to the Snake which feeds FOH and Monitor Consoles,......and the instrument out on the DI goes to your personal instrument amp on stage....

Thats how its done....
If you start messing without balanced lines to a house system, you will be messing with grounds, creating push and pull , RF..., not to mention you dont have separate volume controls for Phones and line out....

Any real venue will have sufficient DI boxes for bass players and Keyboards....Mics plug straight into the snake....

ah, sorry. I get it. I was thinking back to the studio... The only time i've dealed with a direct box is to connect guitar direct to the recording console...