Alternative use of vocoder on R3

[antitolg]

i never used a vocoder before i purchased my R3 and now i'm curious if (and how) i could use it to create the vocal effect on pink floyd's "one of these days (i'm going to cut you into little pieces)". it's the vocal part where the intro ends and right before the whole band kicks in. for those who haven't heard the song but interested in a challenge to recreate it, just let me know and i'll post a youtube link

thanks,

t.

[X-Trade]

I think on the original recording (and live) the vocal comes from rick wright's voice going into a pitch shifter (down one octave?) and possibly a static phaser or comb filter.

There is a pitch shifter effect on the R3 I believe. At least there is one on my radias, and I think they have pretty much the same effects.


The vocoder can be used for things other than voice though. Generally anything with interesting formant structure or a lack of pitch, for example you can run drums through it, play a chord, and get pitched/chorded drums, run a guitar through it to get a strumming effect, or run noise through it for a very noisy pad.

[axxim]

Yes it seems to me a pitch shifter too and yes, the R3 has a pitch shifter too.
You can also use the vocoder to shift the pitch, but the voice characteristic will be lost beeing replaced by the carrier's one.
Maybe using the voice as both (formant and carrier) and shifting the filters one octave down can achieve this kind of effect.

If you want some hints about vocoders, you can visit my homepage at:

http://www.axxim.de/korg_r3

[antitolg]

thank you for the fast replies.

I think on the original recording (and live) the vocal comes from rick wright's voice going into a pitch shifter (down one octave?) and possibly a static phaser or comb filter.

There is a pitch shifter effect on the R3 I believe. At least there is one on my radias, and I think they have pretty much the same effects.

well that is exactly what i'm after: bending my voice down (and thickening it if necessary) and applying some fx to get at least close to what PF do.

the only problem (to me) is that if i use the vocoder for that effect my voice would be stuck to the note i'd have to hold. thus i imagine i should use the audio-in feature. i'd try it ASAP but i don't have a mic suitable for that input at the moment. so i would be glad if you could at least guide me the through the steps i should take. or could i get away with the on board mic? (though i guess not since it's routed to the vocoder as default).

and off the topic: i believe it was you who suggested creating analog sound patches for the radias, no? and somebody suggested them to be available for the R3 as well. count me in as well for that request as i could surely use such patches to help me design my own, since the thing that frustrates me the most about the R3 is the patches which cover territories i don't want/need instead of analog emulations of moogs, solinas and etc.)

Yes it seems to me a pitch shifter too and yes, the R3 has a pitch shifter too.
You can also use the vocoder to shift the pitch, but the voice characteristic will be lost beeing replaced by the carrier's one.
Maybe using the voice as both (formant and carrier) and shifting the filters one octave down can achieve this kind of effect.

If you want some hints about vocoders, you can visit my homepage at:

http://www.axxim.de/korg_r3

thank you axxim. i think the onboard vocoder thingie won't work (due to reasons i explained above/and you reasoned the same in your reply) but i might have a shot if i used a dynamic mic connected to audio in. and if the R3 allows fx (pitch shift and so on) to be applied to that signal without the constraints of a vocoder (being stuck with notes you play: my voice needs to go through as it is) then it should be all right.

[X-Trade]

thank you for the fast replies.

I think on the original recording (and live) the vocal comes from rick wright's voice going into a pitch shifter (down one octave?) and possibly a static phaser or comb filter.

There is a pitch shifter effect on the R3 I believe. At least there is one on my radias, and I think they have pretty much the same effects.

well that is exactly what i'm after: bending my voice down (and thickening it if necessary) and applying some fx to get at least close to what PF do.

the only problem (to me) is that if i use the vocoder for that effect my voice would be stuck to the note i'd have to hold. thus i imagine i should use the audio-in feature. i'd try it ASAP but i don't have a mic suitable for that input at the moment. so i would be glad if you could at least guide me the through the steps i should take. or could i get away with the on board mic? (though i guess not since it's routed to the vocoder as default).

you are right in thinking that the vocoder wouldn't be right, because it transforms your vocal to the pitch of the synthesizer input.
The vocoder isn't really part of the synthesizer, its kind of separate, because what it actually does is take two inputs - a synth input and a vocoder input. so for example you could have a guitar or an electric piano or any other kind of sound to transform your voice with, just as you could use drums or something instead of vocals.

The built in mic isn't 'routed to the vocoder as default'. The vocoder isn't even on by default, until you turn it on for that patch (even the 'vocoder bank' is just a bank, it doesn't have to be the only place for vocoder programs).

The mic is directed to Audio Input 2, which you can use for vocoder input, or for the audio in utility, or you can set it to pass straight through to the output.

I don't have an R3. I have a Radias, but I know vaguely what you want to do.
Firstly you need an initialised patch. Then you need to set oscillator 1 to 'Audio In'. leave the filters completely open, oscillator 2 off, drive off (or on a very mild amount), etc. You may have to set the input balance all the way to the right or whatever they call it to choose input 2. to the left would choose input 1, in the middle a mix of both, etc.

You still have to press keys to play, but thats just to open the amp EG. you could set the release time rather high if you like, but at least it'll prevent feedback etc if you are playing live. I would also set the patch to mono rather than polyphonic so that it won't come out louder if you press more than one key.

Next just go and set up a pitch shifter effect on that timbre's IFX. Play around with the parameters

[antitolg]

worked like a charm (the trick being assigning the audio-in to osc).

thanks a lot x-trade. but do confirm me about the analog patches:)

[X-Trade]

My analog set isn't finished yet. You can probably tell I am a true perfectionist. I'm looking to release the radias version soon, and will be working with McHale on converting some of them for the EXB-Radias in the M3, so I would certainly consider having them converted for the R3 or MKXL too at some point. I own neither of these though so I would need to work with someone who can take parameter numbers or screenshots from the editor from me and recreate them on the other.
Then we'd have to record them and make sure they sound right. I wouldn't be happy if they were below the quality I expect of my patches.

[antitolg]

well i owe you one for the vocoder so i'll do what i can when you're ready to share and convert your patches.

regards,

t.

[axxim]

My analog set isn't finished yet. You can probably tell I am a true perfectionist. I'm looking to release the radias version soon, and will be working with McHale on converting some of them for the EXB-Radias in the M3, so I would certainly consider having them converted for the R3 or MKXL too at some point. I own neither of these though so I would need to work with someone who can take parameter numbers or screenshots from the editor from me and recreate them on the other.
Then we'd have to record them and make sure they sound right. I wouldn't be happy if they were below the quality I expect of my patches.

In converting those to an R3, maybe I could help. If you have one patch finished, I can try to convert it if you want X-Trade

[downtownpaulyp]

From http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/One_of_The ... yd_song%29:

"The threat, a rare vocal contribution by Nick Mason, was recorded through a ring modulator and slowed down to create an eerie effect."

So try running your voice through a ring mod, then into a pitch shifter in the Master Effect section.