Arpeggiator on the fly

anclibertees · Post by **anclibertees** » Mon Aug 30, 2010 2:04 am

Hi could anyone tell me if I need to change a setting on the R3 to enable it to update the synth sound in real time while using the arpeggiator?

If I change the sound of the synth while the arp is running the sound does not change, it is only when I stop and restart the arp in latch mode or retrigger the chord being played that the sound updates.

This is very irritating for recording or poor in a live situation, just when you think you've got the right sound playing in a groove and stop to prepare for recording only to find some synth settings have changed or not what was intended/expected.

Save me!

axxim · Post by **axxim** » Mon Aug 30, 2010 1:08 pm

anclibertees wrote:Hi could anyone tell me if I need to change a setting on the R3 to enable it to update the synth sound in real time while using the arpeggiator?

If I change the sound of the synth while the arp is running the sound does not change, it is only when I stop and restart the arp in latch mode or retrigger the chord being played that the sound updates.

This is very irritating for recording or poor in a live situation, just when you think you've got the right sound playing in a groove and stop to prepare for recording only to find some synth settings have changed or not what was intended/expected.

Save me!

Changing the sound on the R3 (Radias too) in normal mode will stop the sound of the notes played and until you (re)press a new key no sound of the new patch will be played. This means that changing a patch stops aktivity on the prior patch. With the arp it is a little different, maybe because the arp has a higher priority as a patch change, so you have to stop the arp, change patch aqnd restart the arp.

It's an issue that is complained often here but each synth has its limitations.

anclibertees · Post by **anclibertees** » Mon Aug 30, 2010 4:28 pm

Thanks for replying

You would think that synths would have improved enough over the years and these limitations would have been overcome, these digital synths are no more than software with a front end controller attached, the build quality is very poor and it looks like it cost 50p to make, I just know the pots are going to brake soon. The Microkorg was built better and for that matter my yamaha pss480 from the 1980s is built better.

The r3 should have just been a midi box with a computer driven interface.

Why can't I route anything to anything and change the order of the internal modules? It's software.

It seems that the synth companies are just reinventing the wheel everytime they put out a new synth, they are not getting better, just saving manufacturing costs. I wish I had bought a Novation for half the price double the build quality and triple usability.

rant over, sorry

X-Trade · Post by **X-Trade** » Mon Aug 30, 2010 6:00 pm

I have no problem adjusting parameters whilst the arp is playing on the Radias.

Obviously some parameters like envelopes and LFOs can not really have a discernable effect if they are being triggered all the time by the LFO.
Also turning on/off some features such as unison, filter routing, arpeggiator, etc, will cause a break in the sound where current notes stop playing. I too think this is just lazy and could have been handled much better. KORG's previous-gen synths handle it just fine so why did they have to go back a step? sure it is more flexible but less live-friendly... Instead of stopping the currently playing notes it *should* just wait and only apply the changes that require reconfiguration of the voicing mode to the next played notes - I don't see why existing notes have to be stopped.

Anyway, it is difficult to tell your problem without more information. Exactly what parameters are you changing that have 'no effect' and what kind of arp pattern are you running?

benef · Post by **benef** » Tue Aug 31, 2010 12:22 am

I too am curious as to what parameters exactly you're speaking of... just the other night I was experimenting with the arpeggiator, and there were actually some amazing and dynamic sounds that were created. I actually find when creating a program, latching a few notes and then having the freedom to use both hands to flip through and change the variables is a great route to developing a sound. I found also some neat effects by changing the gate/swing, along with EG1 int (w/ say 30Attack), maybe a bit of delay effect, to create some really funky rhythms, all real-time modulation.

So that's my experience with the arp, what am I missing? hehe

axxim · Post by **axxim** » Tue Aug 31, 2010 7:28 am

X-Trade wrote:Anyway, it is difficult to tell your problem without more information. Exactly what parameters are you changing that have 'no effect' and what kind of arp pattern are you running?

I think what anclibertees meant with "changing the sound" is simply changing the pach (sound programm) and not the parameters, even if the last line is a bit confusing

X-Trade · Post by **X-Trade** » Tue Aug 31, 2010 7:33 am

Well, the OP was talking about parameters being changed too, in the last paragraph.

The Arp settings are stored in a program, so if you have Arp on and then change programs, the Arp will go off.
Which gives me an idea for another feature suggestion - arpeggiator lock.

anclibertees · Post by **anclibertees** » Wed Sep 01, 2010 4:50 pm

It may well be that it is some of the filters or mods don't update until they are re triggered because of the internal routing structure. My main gripe is when running a midi arrangement(piano roll) from a daw, with the arp where the midi is acting as if keys are being pressed, I can't get the arp to function in this mode at all. It works fine on my friends novation ks5 and enables you to create complex patterns and sounds without any fuss. Theres very little in the r3 manual and I can't find any arp sync or lock.

Any ideas

X-Trade · Post by **X-Trade** » Wed Sep 01, 2010 7:03 pm

Yes, if your sound is legato mono then some parameters will need the sound to be retriggered before they take effect. Off the top of my head, these are:
Unison voice mode, filter routing, drive/waveshaper type, filter 2 type (I think), ring, sync, oscillator 1 mod type.

If your arpeggiator is generating a sequence which is legato then the note won't be retriggering, just changing note. This becomes obvious if you set the envelope to a simple Attack=0, Decay=64, Sustain=0, Release=0.

As for triggering the arpeggiator, you have to change the MIDI mode slightly. There are two 'convert positions', which basically set where the MIDI is transmitted from and injected into, in the system structure. On the contrary, It is mentioned in the manual in the global mode settings. In fact korg have listed every parameter which is in the R3, you just have to have the patience to find it.

In one mode, MIDI Out comes from the keyboard, and MIDI In is routed to trigger the arpeggiator.
In the other mode, MIDI Out comes from the arpeggiator, and MIDI In bypasses the arpeggiator.
The reason for the two modes is mainly so that you can record MIDI to a sequencer or DAW, play it back, and get exactly the same result you played in. So if you want to control the arpeggiator you'll need to change that mode such that MIDI comes in before the 'tone generator'.

As for synchronisation. It is to do with the MIDI Clock. I can't remember the name of the parameter, and it will be specific to the R3, but it should be mentioned near to the Convert Position parameter too.

It is all in the manual...

dasystem · Post by **dasystem** » Tue Jan 04, 2011 5:01 pm

newbie so dont laugh:

while the sequencer is running is it possible to change the actual notes. It would be great if the nobs above each step (adsr) could change the notes. I just got this beautiful thing 2 days ago so please excuse my ignorance. I would like to use the radias as an analog sequencer for my micromoog and ms10

X-Trade · Post by **X-Trade** » Tue Jan 04, 2011 5:08 pm

dasystem wrote:newbie so dont laugh:

while the sequencer is running is it possible to change the actual notes. It would be great if the nobs above each step (adsr) could change the notes. I just got this beautiful thing 2 days ago so please excuse my ignorance. I would like to use the radias as an analog sequencer for my micromoog and ms10

You can't use the knobs to control the pitch, however if you are using the step sequencers and the 16 keys are in 'trigger' mode, you can scroll through the different notes and turn them on or off for each step. Same goes for if the sequencer is controlling a drum part, you can select each drum. You can only put eight notes into a step though.

I think to access the notes you have to go to the step sequencer 2nd page (after 'common', before 'step edit') and scroll the note selection at the top of the page. You can use the controls on the screen to mute/unmute steps or notes too.

dasystem · Post by **dasystem** » Tue Jan 04, 2011 5:18 pm

X-Trade wrote:
dasystem wrote:newbie so dont laugh:

while the sequencer is running is it possible to change the actual notes. It would be great if the nobs above each step (adsr) could change the notes. I just got this beautiful thing 2 days ago so please excuse my ignorance. I would like to use the radias as an analog sequencer for my micromoog and ms10
You can't use the knobs to control the pitch, however if you are using the step sequencers and the 16 keys are in 'trigger' mode, you can scroll through the different notes and turn them on or off for each step. Same goes for if the sequencer is controlling a drum part, you can select each drum. You can only put eight notes into a step though.

I think to access the notes you have to go to the step sequencer 2nd page (after 'common', before 'step edit') and scroll the note selection at the top of the page. You can use the controls on the screen to mute/unmute steps or notes too.

Thanks for your super quick response X-trade.
wow its pretty silly they didnt include that function, maybe there is a way to assign pitch via cc? That would have been great.

here is my most recent animation / sound design:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8CreQAhtYM0&hd=1

X-Trade · Post by **X-Trade** » Tue Jan 04, 2011 5:44 pm

Well the Radias isn't really designed for external control.

You can use the modulation sequencers to control the pitch of the Radias' own oscillators, but it is not triggering new notes so it is not really sending note data. And AFAIK the modulation sequencers don't output MIDI at all, which would actually be rather hard to do anyway (as some people would also suggest it is silly they didn't include this, but) because quite often the modulation sequencers can be polyphonic, starting a from the beginning for each note.

dasystem · Post by **dasystem** » Tue Jan 04, 2011 6:14 pm

X-Trade wrote:Well the Radias isn't really designed for external control.

You can use the modulation sequencers to control the pitch of the Radias' own oscillators, but it is not triggering new notes so it is not really sending note data. And AFAIK the modulation sequencers don't output MIDI at all, which would actually be rather hard to do anyway (as some people would also suggest it is silly they didn't include this, but) because quite often the modulation sequencers can be polyphonic, starting a from the beginning for each note.

Yes! I havent tried the modulation sequencer yet, I just got this a few days ago. Regardless, its one of the greatest new toys I've had in a while. I'll look out for a hardware sequencer, I hear the rs7000's sequencer is the best. For now i'm using the asr-10's sequencer to control all the vintage synths. Radias is badddasssss

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