Is any of you using..

kikedeolivos · Post by **kikedeolivos** » Fri Oct 15, 2010 11:46 pm

the sequencer and arpeggiattors live with a band WITHOUT computers? I mean, LIVE without a metronome on the drummer's ears?

I guess it's impossible but if not, how do you achieve sync tempo with the other band members? (Guitars, bass guitar and drums)

We play everything live but a pre recorded phrase in the middle of a song would not hurt.

mocando · Post by **mocando** » Sat Oct 16, 2010 12:34 am

i was wondering exactly the same, kike. Specially on many Genesis songs where the tempo changes midsong. How do you do it ?

I want to start playing live with click but how is the question. I mean, the source of the click should be something that is aware of the tempo changes. A computer is the only solution that I see.

Kim Lajoie · Post by **Kim Lajoie** » Sat Oct 16, 2010 12:44 am

I'd probably do it the same way I'd do a backing track - main audio on one side (eg panned left), and a click/beat on the other side (eg panned right). Feed one side to the PA and the other side to your drummer's foldback.

-Kim.

Ghost301 · Post by **Ghost301** » Sat Oct 16, 2010 2:03 am

remember that button that says tap tempo? use it.

McHale · Post by **McHale** » Sat Oct 16, 2010 2:46 am

With a previous band, I used to do Won't Get Fooled Again (did it with the arp) and had no problem. My current drummer doesn't listen even though he uses "In Ears" so he rushes ahead. We will never be able to do that song.

kikedeolivos · Post by **kikedeolivos** » Sat Oct 16, 2010 4:25 am

Ghost301 wrote:remember that button that says tap tempo? use it.

Time to enlighten elderly people...would you mind?

guillex · Post by **guillex** » Sat Oct 16, 2010 6:12 am

Kike check your mesagges, I've sent you an answer (en castellano).

X-Trade · Post by **X-Trade** » Sat Oct 16, 2010 6:56 am

Mocando, If you are using a click track from the M50's sequencer or some device MIDI synced to the M50 (so you don't have to do all the panning and routing business that is a mess on the M50), then it is still really easy. You know, you can sequence tempo changes into the track on the sequencer.

The whole point of the click is to get everyone to play in time. A lot of professional bands use it, especially where presequenced material or backing tracks are used. But wanting to get the click to sync up with your band mates is the wrong way around!

In some cases where the keyboardist leads or at least a rhythmic keyboard sound runs all the way through (like the Who track already mentioned) it is not necessary. All you need to do is make sure that all the other members can hear you.

kikedeolivos · Post by **kikedeolivos** » Sat Oct 16, 2010 1:48 pm

guillex wrote:Kike check your mesagges, I've sent you an answer (en castellano).

Hi Guille, you have a PM.

kikedeolivos · Post by **kikedeolivos** » Sat Oct 16, 2010 1:50 pm

Just a quick comment:

1) My drummer's tempo is good, but not as good to follow a metronome.

2) He refuses to use headphones or a click track.

Ghost301 · Post by **Ghost301** » Sat Oct 16, 2010 9:14 pm

kikedeolivos wrote:
Ghost301 wrote:remember that button that says tap tempo? use it.
Time to enlighten elderly people...would you mind?

Okay so there should be a tap tempo button on your m50 below the tempo knob so you mentioned using sequencer/arps as a phrase in the middle of the song. what i would try is tapping that button to the beat of your drummer just before you want that part to come in, so the tempo on the m50 should be very close to that of your drummer. and as long as you dont keep that part going for to long and trigger it on time it should stay generally in sync with your drummer

mocando · Post by **mocando** » Sun Oct 17, 2010 6:21 am

X-Trade wrote:Mocando, If you are using a click track from the M50's sequencer or some device MIDI synced to the M50 (so you don't have to do all the panning and routing business that is a mess on the M50), then it is still really easy. You know, you can sequence tempo changes into the track on the sequencer.

The whole point of the click is to get everyone to play in time. A lot of professional bands use it, especially where presequenced material or backing tracks are used. But wanting to get the click to sync up with your band mates is the wrong way around!

In some cases where the keyboardist leads or at least a rhythmic keyboard sound runs all the way through (like the Who track already mentioned) it is not necessary. All you need to do is make sure that all the other members can hear you.

Good tips, as always. Regarding the last part, sometimes I just to need to be in tempo, then everyone else follows. We haven't tried to play with click yet, we are scared it will throw away all our groove

by fixing ourselves to a metronome. But I think we will have to sometime in the near future.

Regarding programing the click using the M50 sequencer, I think is not a good idea because, how would you isolate the click from the main out so we hear it on the headphones only ?

Kim Lajoie · Post by **Kim Lajoie** » Sun Oct 17, 2010 6:28 am

mocando wrote:Regarding programing the click using the M50 sequencer, I think is not a good idea because, how would you isolate the click from the main out so we hear it on the headphones only ?

Kim Lajoie wrote:I'd probably do it the same way I'd do a backing track - main audio on one side (eg panned left), and a click/beat on the other side (eg panned right). Feed one side to the PA and the other side to your drummer's foldback.

-Kim.

kikedeolivos · Post by **kikedeolivos** » Mon Oct 18, 2010 1:02 am

Ghost301 wrote:
kikedeolivos wrote:
Ghost301 wrote:remember that button that says tap tempo? use it.
Time to enlighten elderly people...would you mind?
Okay so there should be a tap tempo button on your m50 below the tempo knob so you mentioned using sequencer/arps as a phrase in the middle of the song. what i would try is tapping that button to the beat of your drummer just before you want that part to come in, so the tempo on the m50 should be very close to that of your drummer. and as long as you dont keep that part going for to long and trigger it on time it should stay generally in sync with your drummer

Questions

1) Let's say it's a 4/4 tune: do you TAP only in the first beat of each measure or on all of them? (4)

2) Also, the phrase on the M50 should be similar to the drummer's tempo?

3) Should I wait for the drummer's beat, then tap tempo and then play the phrase?

Thanks

Laste7 · Post by **Laste7** » Fri Oct 22, 2010 12:48 pm

Do you use a second keyboard? Live I use the M50 and a StagePiano. The piano has a Metronome inside which can be controlled by Midi (Standard: Track10 --> It is a normal Drum Kit, but has just two different kind of clicks). I made a "ClickTrack" on the M50 and put the MidiDevice to "extern" for Track10. The Piano uses the sound of the M50, so I can turn of the local sound. Just the click appears, and this signal goes directly from the headphonejack to the submixer of the drummer...