Please... PLEASE can we have this guitar?

NuSkoolTone · Post by **NuSkoolTone** » Mon Oct 17, 2011 11:37 pm

This is from the PA3X. There is nothing even REMOTELY close to this in the Kronos. This shows Korg really CAN do guitars!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zP-GxPBn ... re=related

Pretty please Korg?

apex · Post by **apex** » Mon Oct 17, 2011 11:52 pm

why don't you just create it using the STR-1 engine... that's its specialty.... stringed instruments....

NuSkoolTone · Post by **NuSkoolTone** » Tue Oct 18, 2011 12:00 am

apex wrote:why don't you just create it using the STR-1 engine... that's its specialty.... stringed instruments....

I HIGHLY doubt you're going to get that with STR-1. I haven't looked deep enough into STR-1 to give a competent answer, though AFAIK you need some samples as a starting point to get that sort of realism. While some of the STR-1 is cool to my ears, it really needs to be augmented with some credible samples. There's also the ROOM that's in that sound, which is a big part of it to my ears. Perhaps it's a bad assumption on my part, but if the Kronos could already do that sound it'd already have it and would have been featured in the demos IMO.

Rosen Sound · Post by **Rosen Sound** » Tue Oct 18, 2011 12:07 am

NuSkoolTone wrote:
apex wrote:why don't you just create it using the STR-1 engine... that's its specialty.... stringed instruments....
I HIGHLY doubt you're going to get that with STR-1. I haven't looked deep enough into STR-1 to give a competent answer, though AFAIK you need some samples as a starting point to get that sort of realism. While some of the STR-1 is cool to my ears, it really needs to be augmented with some credible samples. There's also the ROOM that's in that sound, which is a big part of it to my ears. Perhaps it's a bad assumption on my part, but if the Kronos could already do that sound it'd already have it and would have been featured in the demos IMO.

korgs presets and demos show about 40% of the machines capabilities imho

Hooch · Post by **Hooch** » Tue Oct 18, 2011 5:39 am

If you strip the tone down to the bare patch on the more realistic sounding boards out there, you'll find where you need to start. It's quite surprising sometimes. The effects are really about getting the woody distortion/tube overdrive character out of that basic sound.

But that basic sound has to be right.
A lot of the raw pick up compression is in the basic tone.

A strat straight in to a twin reverb on the bridge pick up raw. That's the basic tone you want.

Hooch

BasariStudios · Post by **BasariStudios** » Tue Oct 18, 2011 6:20 am

No STR-1 can do this, this is done with DNC on PA800-2X-3X, Kronos cannot
even come close to this kind of Articulation with all its EXis. Its a completely
different concept and it will never be implemented on Kronos or M3.

BasariStudios · Post by **BasariStudios** » Tue Oct 18, 2011 6:22 am

Hooch wrote:If you strip the tone down to the bare patch on the more realistic sounding boards out there, you'll find where you need to start. It's quite surprising sometimes. The effects are really about getting the woody distortion/tube overdrive character out of that basic sound.

But that basic sound has to be right.
A lot of the raw pick up compression is in the basic tone.

A strat straight in to a twin reverb on the bridge pick up raw. That's the basic tone you want.

Hooch

Its a lot more then that. DNC is something very complicated, it can be consisted
of 16 different KMPS/LAYERS, all triggered at different movement of fingers and
other techniques...this is not something NOT complicated. To understand why
PA3X Sounds like THIS one needs to know DNC very deep. And again NO,
KRONOS has nothing even close to this, not the Sound but DNC in general.

Sina172 · Post by **Sina172** » Tue Oct 18, 2011 7:44 am

NuSkoolTone · Post by **NuSkoolTone** » Tue Oct 18, 2011 12:15 pm

OK I understand how DNC is so crucial to that sound. However there is a wrinkle in the whole theory. While obviously not quite as good, my Motif XS has Nylon guitars approaching that level of realism, is strictly sample based (With articulation switching) and is 3 years old. I have no way to separate where the samples end and DNC begins, but it just sounds like the guitar samples are still from 2005 if not older. It's not why I bought the Kronos obviously, but it's still disappointing and could be easily remedied with at the least a proper EXi. Perhaps it won't be the PA3X, but at least on par with other modern workstations in that sound category. This goes for the electric guitars too! Of course, IMO and YMMV.

SanderXpander · Post by **SanderXpander** » Tue Oct 18, 2011 12:26 pm

Considering the basic idea of the Kronos is derived from Oasys, which had several entirely new synth engines added to it during its support cycle, I don't think you could say confidently that the PA3X's DNC "will never be implemented on Kronos". Perhaps they won't do it because of financial reasons, but it would definitely be possible through an EXi, if not an EXs. If they feel they need to do it to keep the edge or stay competitive, they will, I should think. So here's to Roland and Yamaha putting the pressure on!

jemkeys25 · Post by **jemkeys25** » Tue Oct 18, 2011 1:37 pm

the sound you want isn't always in the factory set, the kronos has all the tools to make the sounds you want, do you have patience to find how to program those sounds?

BasariStudios · Post by **BasariStudios** » Tue Oct 18, 2011 2:00 pm

Sander, NO, it would never be implemented...no matter of what the reason is.
Jeremy, NO, no matter what tools Kronos offers now this cannot be programmed,
the TOOLS just arent' there, Kronos cannot switch between layers based only
on different movements of your fingers while the PA3X can and the whole DNC
phenomena is based mostly on that.

Shakil · Post by **Shakil** » Tue Oct 18, 2011 2:04 pm

In my humble opinion, that doesn't sound too realistic to me. the decay is very unnatural.... yes, different sounds are triggerred by DNC.. but if you listen to it closely you can tell that everytime the same sample is picked up, it sounds same and with same decay....

On STR-1, each string sound is generated in real time, so playing the same notes can sound slightly different, even when played at the same velocity.... it just sounds more organic, hence more natural sound character.... playing technique is a different story...

michelkeijzers · Post by **michelkeijzers** » Tue Oct 18, 2011 2:08 pm

Everything is software ... I don't know if the minimum speed/memory requirements are met by the Kronos for DNC, but I doubt it will be a problem for Kronos. Probably it is a commercial reason.

SanderXpander · Post by **SanderXpander** » Tue Oct 18, 2011 2:12 pm

BasariStudios wrote: Sander, NO, it would never be implemented...no matter of what the reason is.

Um, great argument? Again, I can imagine them not doing it for financial reasons (having to engineer it as well as product separation between synths and arrangers) but there is no reason at all it could not be turned into an EXi. They probably won't, I agree. But I dislike blanket statements like your quote above.