KP3 and Kaossilator Pro with Vocals. Problems, questions.

[redimp]

Hey guys. After several years of using devices and reading this forums I finally decided to register. Mainly because there are things that I am still not able to figure out on my own and I need help.

So background – I am a vocalist, using KP3 (older version) and Kaossilator pro (also older) for live effects and synth. We play progressive rock, sometimes heavier stuff.

My routing is this – Electrovoice supercardioid mic --> Mic input on KP3 --> line out of KP3 to Line in of Kaossilator --> line out to mixer or d-box with a pair of jacks

I routed KP3 first as I like to use some of the synths from kaossilator while singing with delay, and I also use kaossilators line/mic toggle as a killswitch to cut off the delay tails in the pauses of our songs.

This setup works OK on rehearsals, but I constantly have troubles during live performances or recording.

So here come my questions:

1) What is the best way to put my mic's signal into KP3?

Right now I am using regular Mic input, with gain always being around 0 and input level being turned halfway up (facing 12 o'clock). This makes KP3 peak pretty easily, especially on choruses where the velocity of vocals is pretty high. I usually sing in orange zone, that varies to green (subtle parts) and red (choruses and stuff), so 80% of the time my vocals are peaking and sound overdriven. I cannot dial gain or input level down, as the output level is not enough to make vocals readable in the mix.

So the problem is basically like this – to be heard I need to be overdriven.
Every single live that we play I am getting asked by sound engineers to throw the kaosses away and plug directly into mixer with my mic, as they are getting frustrated with all the problems during sound check. I never do give the devices up as they play pretty important role in my performance, and end up sounding shitty.

2) Is there a way to bypass any sort of EQ built into KP3?

When we are recording vocals the process is like this – record -->autotune --> play parts of tuned track through KP3 and record the output. We do this for effects that cannot be replicated with standard plug-ins, like loop effects, KP Rnb section effects (especially RNB 5 nd 6). After playing the outcome you can clearly hear the difference in equalisation.

KP3 adds digital noise, pumps up Hi and Hi Med frequencies, cuts of Med, Low Med and Low frequencies a little bit. The difference is drastic, and since there is no point to apply KP3 to all the vocal track you can hear the difference between parts that were processed by KP3.

3) Do the new models (those that have Plus in the title) of Kaossilator and KP have same issues? I'm just thinking maybe I do have a failed units or something.

4) Will it be any better if I buy the preamp for the vocals, and route Mic into preamp, then into KP3 line in instead of mic input?

Thanks in advance.

[Spheric El]

I don't use the mic input on the KP generally.Prefare my mixer pre amps sent into line in. Never noticed the mid cut /high boost you talk about, even when I have used the KP mic In. Then I haven't A/B'd it with original take like you ,but I thought I would of noticed. Are you using a tip/ring/sleeve cable (balanced) into the mic input? (The KP will be tip/sleeve).
I'm not familiar with the Kpro -does it have a mic input ,if so ,test the input straight through that and record.If that's ok you know it's the KP.If your mixer has a Prefade send ,then have a test with using that.
As far as live I've never used it that way but I'd say stick with what your comfy with regardless of what sound engineers want to sound check with -as long as it works and the results are desirable.
Ps a mic pre may be a good idea but I have no experiance of this and need someone else to comment.

[hfdz0]

A mic pre amp will definitely give you more control over the level of your vocals, but the KP3 will probably still start clipping before you want it to. AFAIK the mic inputs on KP products are more for vocoder capabilities, and are not going to give you great quality sound if you want a clean and simple audio signal for your vocals.

I would suggest taking the sound guys' advice and plugging your mic into their mixer, then getting an output cable from them to plug into your KP3 for the vocal effects. Otherwise, get your own mixer / or adapter to be able to connect the mic into the line in jacks on the back of the KP3 for better sound quality and control.

I've read that a lot of the KP products have problems with clipping to soon. I bypass the issue by using headphones (you can simply get a male 1/4 '' to whatever jack / male end you want to plug into speakers or amps for playing live), which has its own volume knob. I set the volume knob higher and the "bar graph" levels and line in volumes on the KP3 lower. This way the KP3 is sending a greater volume and can receive a relatively lower audio signal resulting in a higher peak and no loss in volume as heard by the audience.