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ChrisDuncan Senior Member
Joined: 17 May 2018 Posts: 391
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Posted: Sat Jan 23, 2021 6:47 pm Post subject: |
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There's not much new about the OS. It's just a fork that allows for the simplicity and slimmed down feature set of the Nautilis. Dark mode is about the only tip of the hat to more modern UI design. Under the hood it's still the same dense, fiddly, power user UI (which I'm fine with).
In terms of cosmetics / coolness factor they'd need to do a complete rewrite of the UI to compare favorably to the current Yamaha and Roland offerings. Don't know that such a move would make financial sense as it would take more time and cost more money, so instead they just trimmed down the Kronos a bit, put it in a cheaper package, and now have a new midline product to sell. From a cost / benefit analysis for the company, it was a good decision.
As a Kronos owner, the only thing the video did was make me appreciate what I already have. This is just a Kronos Jr., and I already have the real thing. I bought it for what it does and have been happy with that.
I seriously doubt there will be any significant updates to the Kronos OS. It's already a monster keyboard / workstation, and I doubt that time and money spent on incremental improvements would make it sell enough new units to justify the cost. That's just business.
I would imagine that there are teams in Korg working on the Next New Thing. However, the engineers' efforts are probably tempered by the fact that it's unclear what the Next New Thing should be in market terms.
Should there be another new, monster workstation like the Kronos? Are there really enough things that are truly new (i.e. that the Kronos and competitors don't already do) to justify a new flagship? Or is the market moving towards mid priced hardware and more integration with computers, e.g. the NI Komplete Kontrol keyboard approach?
Takes a lot of money to design a new product from the ground up, and it's a huge gamble in terms of whether it actually sells. Glad I'm not putting my own money on the table for that, because I really don't know which direction the Next New Thing is going to go.
In the meantime, I continue to enjoy the Kronos for what it is. _________________ Studio: Cubase 13 | Windows 10 | Yamaha TF5 | Mackie MCU | CMC AI, QC
Keyboard Station: Kronos 2 88 | Fantom 7 | JV 2080 | Cubase 13 | Windows 10 | Focusrite 18i20 | CMC TP
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Chris Duncan
Atlanta, GA, USA, Earth |
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GregC Platinum Member
Joined: 15 May 2002 Posts: 9451 Location: Discovery Bay (San Francisco Bay Area)
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Posted: Sat Jan 23, 2021 7:45 pm Post subject: |
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ChrisDuncan wrote: | There's not much new about the OS. It's just a fork that allows for the simplicity and slimmed down feature set of the Nautilis. Dark mode is about the only tip of the hat to more modern UI design. Under the hood it's still the same dense, fiddly, power user UI (which I'm fine with).
In terms of cosmetics / coolness factor they'd need to do a complete rewrite of the UI to compare favorably to the current Yamaha and Roland offerings. Don't know that such a move would make financial sense as it would take more time and cost more money, so instead they just trimmed down the Kronos a bit, put it in a cheaper package, and now have a new midline product to sell. From a cost / benefit analysis for the company, it was a good decision.
As a Kronos owner, the only thing the video did was make me appreciate what I already have. This is just a Kronos Jr., and I already have the real thing. I bought it for what it does and have been happy with that.
I seriously doubt there will be any significant updates to the Kronos OS. It's already a monster keyboard / workstation, and I doubt that time and money spent on incremental improvements would make it sell enough new units to justify the cost. That's just business.
I would imagine that there are teams in Korg working on the Next New Thing. However, the engineers' efforts are probably tempered by the fact that it's unclear what the Next New Thing should be in market terms.
Should there be another new, monster workstation like the Kronos? Are there really enough things that are truly new (i.e. that the Kronos and competitors don't already do) to justify a new flagship? Or is the market moving towards mid priced hardware and more integration with computers, e.g. the NI Komplete Kontrol keyboard approach?
Takes a lot of money to design a new product from the ground up, and it's a huge gamble in terms of whether it actually sells. Glad I'm not putting my own money on the table for that, because I really don't know which direction the Next New Thing is going to go.
In the meantime, I continue to enjoy the Kronos for what it is. |
good analysis, Chris.
Back to the O/p desire for Nautilus OS on his Kronos. It will not happen per this
recent Korg Livestream:
that question is answered here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oRWdLGQSEY8 _________________ Kronos 88. MODX8
Achieve your musical dreams
https://soundcloud.com/user-898236994 |
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KingKronos Senior Member
Joined: 02 Jan 2021 Posts: 269
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Posted: Sat Jan 23, 2021 7:59 pm Post subject: |
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ChrisDuncan wrote: |
As a Kronos owner, the only thing the video did was make me appreciate what I already have. This is just a Kronos Jr., and I already have the real thing. I bought it for what it does and have been happy with that.
In the meantime, I continue to enjoy the Kronos for what it is. |
I feel the same way when looking at the Nautilus. Dark mode is nice and all, but not worth trading out the sliders and buttons and KARMA.
I had the same feeling when the wavestate and opsix came out. I think they're junior versions of the Kronos wavestation and MOD7 engines. Not to mention the K already has 5 octaves and aftertouch. |
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SeedyLee Platinum Member
Joined: 13 Sep 2006 Posts: 1378 Location: Perth, Australia
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Posted: Sun Jan 24, 2021 1:11 am Post subject: |
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Korg R+D in California, who I suspect are responsible for the software on the Kronos and Nautilus have also been busy designing the Opsix, Wavestate and Modwave. That’s four products from a relatively small team in a year, so I don’t think we will see a brand new workstation on top of all that too. _________________ Current Equipment:
Korg Kronos 2 88, Reface CS, Roland JV-1080, TE OP1, Moog Subsequent 37, Korg ARP Odyssey, Allen & Heath Zed 18, Adam F5, MOTU MIDI Express XT, Lexicon MX200 & MPX1, Yamaha QY700, Yamaha AW16G, Tascam DP008ex, Zoom H6, Organelle, Roland J6 & JU06A
Previous: Triton LE 61/Sampling/64MB/4GB SCSI, MS2000BR, Kronos 1 61, Monotribe, NanoKontrol, NanoKeys, Kaossilator II, Casio HT3000, Roland VP-03, Reface DX, Novation Mininova, MPC One |
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Mike Conway Approved Merchant
Joined: 28 Jan 2005 Posts: 2434 Location: Las Vegas, Nevada
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Posted: Sun Jan 24, 2021 2:37 am Post subject: |
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ChrisDuncan wrote: | As a Kronos owner, the only thing the video did was make me appreciate what I already have |
I also agree. I would buy another Kronos before getting the Nautilus. I often use the sliders and the rest of the control surface. I also like having a Data Slider. If the Nautilus had, for example, the ModWave and some other new tech, like sequencer and polyphony enhancements, I would be more tempted
KingKronos wrote: | I had the same feeling when the wavestate and opsix came out. I think they're junior versions of the Kronos wavestation and MOD7 engines. Not to mention the K already has 5 octaves and aftertouch. |
Good point. I know those synths offer some nice goodies, but you have many more FX processors in the K, along with user sample input, etc. If I didn't have a Kronos, I might get all 3 of those units - OpSix, Wavestate, and ModWave. I love the OpSix interface.
While I love to play with other synths, the Kronos is all I really need. I recently took it on vacation with me, and scored a TRAILER with it. When I got home, I didn't have to add anything else. Such a workhorse. |
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SeedyLee Platinum Member
Joined: 13 Sep 2006 Posts: 1378 Location: Perth, Australia
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Posted: Sun Jan 24, 2021 3:25 am Post subject: |
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Hey Mike,
I enjoyed your trailer and agree with your sentiments regarding the Kronos.
Out of interest, did you use the Kronos sequencer for the trailer? If so, how did you go with cue points and so on?
Lee _________________ Current Equipment:
Korg Kronos 2 88, Reface CS, Roland JV-1080, TE OP1, Moog Subsequent 37, Korg ARP Odyssey, Allen & Heath Zed 18, Adam F5, MOTU MIDI Express XT, Lexicon MX200 & MPX1, Yamaha QY700, Yamaha AW16G, Tascam DP008ex, Zoom H6, Organelle, Roland J6 & JU06A
Previous: Triton LE 61/Sampling/64MB/4GB SCSI, MS2000BR, Kronos 1 61, Monotribe, NanoKontrol, NanoKeys, Kaossilator II, Casio HT3000, Roland VP-03, Reface DX, Novation Mininova, MPC One |
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Mike Conway Approved Merchant
Joined: 28 Jan 2005 Posts: 2434 Location: Las Vegas, Nevada
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Posted: Sun Jan 24, 2021 3:41 am Post subject: |
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Cue and score detail would be best on a separate topic, but the Kronos sequencer is the only one I use. I usually pick a shot and go from there. I broke it into 3 compositions (roughly 30 seconds each). Easy to put together in the edit. I also made stems (one with the beat/percussion, the other melodic). |
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Liviou2004 Platinum Member
Joined: 20 Feb 2017 Posts: 1150 Location: France
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Posted: Sun Jan 24, 2021 9:13 am Post subject: |
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Watching to the official Korg video showing the Kronos besides the Nautilus ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oRWdLGQSEY8 ), I imagine that Korg could get rid of the Kronos soon.
Perhaps, they try to ensure that the people get use to see the Nautilus and beleive that it is as powerful as the Kronos.
As a matter of fact we can read so many positive comments. I'm sure these comments are coming from people who don't know the Kronos. But that's a fact.
Perhaps I'm wrong. I hope so. |
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keego Senior Member
Joined: 16 Mar 2006 Posts: 329 Location: Liverpool UK
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Posted: Sun Jan 24, 2021 7:57 pm Post subject: |
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Had my Kronos 10 years now and people seem to forget that originally it did not have user sample streaming amongst other features that were added with OS updates.
I have never once regretted the purchase which was made before UK VAT went to 20% so was bought for around £1500 GBP. A 61 key Kronos 2 is around £2399.
New features would be nice but as far as I'm concerned I've already had lots pf new features which I could only have dreamed of when buying 10 years ago! _________________ Current Arsenal:
Kronos 61, Kurzweil PC3K6, Nord Stage 3, Yamaha MOXF8, Muse Receptor 2+, Mainstage
Previous:
Korg:X5D,Wavestation, N364, Trinity,Triton Classic,Triton Studio, Korg M3 61 w/ EXB-Radias
Ensoniq:TS12, SD1, ASR10
Roland:XP10, JD-800, Roland XV88, A90ex
Kurzweil:K2500RS, K2661, PC3
Nord: Electro 3 |
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kronoskarma
Joined: 24 Jan 2021 Posts: 34 Location: Lutz, FL
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Posted: Tue Jan 26, 2021 3:27 am Post subject: |
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I pre-ordered a Nautilus 73 key 3 months ago (and have not cancelled it yet) and have grown impatient - it may actually take another 2 months to get here.
The Nautilus videos actually de-sold me on buying the Nautilus, so I went looking for other keyboards. I did not like the Montage or MODX, hated the Fantom and bought a Korg Krome and returned it after it died on me in a week (that's right - one week and it died).
So, being a Korg guy (I have a Korg Karma with MOSS and a Korg M3 Exp with 88 key keybed), I looked at the Kronos and found a 61 key Titanium edition for less than the Nautilus.
I feel the Nautilus is a cheaply made Kronos (plastic versus metal), almost all knobs, sliders, etc. taken away and a cheaper, slightly smaller and less responsive screen put in its place (all reviewers complained about the screen for the most part). Since almost all functionality now relies on the screen, you would think they would put in the best one money can buy. I actually bought Korg controllers (nanopad and nanostudio) knowing there were almost nothing on the keyboard.
Also, they took away Karma and instead put in a less expressive dual arpeggiator a la Krome, which I had a brief chance to play with. It was good, but not Karma good. The Nautilus gives you four layers of arps (like the 8 scenes of the Kronos Karma).
Otherwise, the two are pretty much the same - 9 engines, sampling, etc. I do not think you can upgrade/add another SSD though, like I did with my Titanium the second I received it.
I feel like the Kronos is a powerful, well built keyboard with almost limitless capability. Other than missing the MIDI Piano Roll editor of the M3 and Krome, it's almost perfect. The Nautilus will also not have the MIDI Piano Roll Editor - a major mistake IMHO.
I'm likely going to cancel my order OR I will let it arrive, play with it side-by-side and make my final decision - unless it gets set back even further. Right now, it won't be here for another 3 or 4 weeks or later.
Mike _________________ Korg Karma
Korg M3 Expanded
Korg Kronos Titanium
Yamaha Tyros 5
Arturia MicroFreak
M-Audio Oxygen 61
Akai Force
Roland MC-707
1010music Black Box
Zoom Arq 48 |
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Mike Conway Approved Merchant
Joined: 28 Jan 2005 Posts: 2434 Location: Las Vegas, Nevada
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Posted: Tue Jan 26, 2021 6:04 am Post subject: |
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kronoskarma wrote: | I'm likely going to cancel my order OR I will let it arrive, play with it side-by-side and make my final decision |
My mind is made up, but I would be interested to hear your take on it, since you would be relatively new to both. Congrats! |
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Liviou2004 Platinum Member
Joined: 20 Feb 2017 Posts: 1150 Location: France
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Posted: Tue Jan 26, 2021 10:01 am Post subject: |
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kronoskarma wrote: | I'm likely going to cancel my order OR I will let it arrive, play with it side-by-side and make my final decision - unless it gets set back even further. Right now, it won't be here for another 3 or 4 weeks or later.
Mike |
I don't know if you are looking for an advice.
If so, what I immediatly thought is : considering the high price of the Nautilus and the fact that you have a Kronos, I would suggest you to look for a completely different synth wich would give you another sound range and enlarge your horizon.
You should wonder : workstation or "simple" synth ? Monophonic, or Polyphonic ? Analog, Digital or Hybrid ? Rather vintage tone or more modern tone, etc.....What kind of sounds you miss ?
According to the responses to these question, there are many posiiblities on different brands.
Here are a few examples of non-workstation (except Yamaha, as you don't like Montage/ModX) :
Moog Matriarch : a wonderful semi-modular full analog synth. A bit less expensive than the Nautilus 73.
Novation Summit : great hybrid poly synth. Less expensive.
Arturia Matrixbrute : Great duophonic synth. Less expensive.
Arturia Polybrute : Polysynth. Same price.
Sequential PRO-3 : Almost the same price.
Sequential Prophet 6 : A little more expensive (about 150 $ more)
All these examples would bring something new to you gear. |
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kronoskarma
Joined: 24 Jan 2021 Posts: 34 Location: Lutz, FL
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Posted: Tue Jan 26, 2021 1:11 pm Post subject: |
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Liviou2004 wrote: | kronoskarma wrote: | I'm likely going to cancel my order OR I will let it arrive, play with it side-by-side and make my final decision - unless it gets set back even further. Right now, it won't be here for another 3 or 4 weeks or later.
Mike |
I don't know if you are looking for an advice.
If so, what I immediatly thought is : considering the high price of the Nautilus and the fact that you have a Kronos, I would suggest you to look for a completely different synth wich would give you another sound range and enlarge your horizon.
You should wonder : workstation or "simple" synth ? Monophonic, or Polyphonic ? Analog, Digital or Hybrid ? Rather vintage tone or more modern tone, etc.....What kind of sounds you miss ?
According to the responses to these question, there are many posiiblities on different brands.
Here are a few examples of non-workstation (except Yamaha, as you don't like Montage/ModX) :
Moog Matriarch : a wonderful semi-modular full analog synth. A bit less expensive than the Nautilus 73.
Novation Summit : great hybrid poly synth. Less expensive.
Arturia Matrixbrute : Great duophonic synth. Less expensive.
Arturia Polybrute : Polysynth. Same price.
Sequential PRO-3 : Almost the same price.
Sequential Prophet 6 : A little more expensive (about 150 $ more)
All these examples would bring something new to you gear. |
LOL. I think I have enough now. Besides my Korg Karma, M3 Exp and Kronos, I also have a Arturia MicroFreak, Yamaha Tyros 5, a Roland MC-707, an Akai Force, a 1010music Black Box and a Zoom Arq 48.
I looked at the MODX and Montage - hated them. The Fantom had some cool capabilities but since I have the MC-707, it's a mute point.
Synthesis-wise, I've got all I'll ever need with the Freak and Kronos (and MOSS on the Karma).
No, I bought the Nautilus so I could travel with it back and forth to my guitar and bass player's house (same guy) and the Kronos (61 key) will fill that slot now.
I'm cancelling my order for sure at this point. I love the Kronos already after only having it a few days.
Mike _________________ Korg Karma
Korg M3 Expanded
Korg Kronos Titanium
Yamaha Tyros 5
Arturia MicroFreak
M-Audio Oxygen 61
Akai Force
Roland MC-707
1010music Black Box
Zoom Arq 48 |
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