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Nightmare!
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gurn
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Joined: 15 Nov 2010
Posts: 193

PostPosted: Sun Sep 18, 2011 10:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

A hair dryer on touchscreen? That is interesting. Heating the screen w/hot air solves the problem? I wish I had thought of that.


Mad Warrior wrote:
Hi!
I have the same problem with touchscreen.
Can't use upper right corner. Calibration doesn't help.

My sotry:
I've bought my M3-M used on eBay this spring. I used it not very much. May be about 2-4 hours a week. It was always in near horizontal position. And there were no problems. In August I moved to a new place. I decided to place it in vertical position. Such placement seems very convinient to me. It was quite hot in a room in August (about 30 Celsius degrees). I used M3 much that days, 4-8 hours every day. In a few days I had the same problem as gurn had. Calibration and reset doesn't help. It operated good sometimes for 20-30 minutes after being turned off for a long time.

I've disassembled my M3, checked all conections inside, cleaned the screen. But the problem remained. So I've put it on the shelf until better times (just don't have enough time to mess with it).
Yesterday I've found gurn's post. And I've tried the same thing. I've put it upside down for 2 hours turned on. After that upper right corner became active but only about one time of ten (not very good, but better than it was). I've put M3 upside down and turned on again and used hot hairdryer on screen for about 20-30 seconds. And wow! After that touchscreen works perfect! No problems all evening. (I am using it in horizontal position now)

So I think the gravity and temperature play big role. Probably we shouldn't use M3 in vertical position in hot places or may be not only in hot places. It is a pity for me, because it is so convinient to place it so. =(
Lucky that I'm from Russia. As you know it is very cold here almost all the time. And bears knock at our doors... Wink

I will test it further and will post my observations.

Best regards!
And sorry for my bad english...

***

McHale wrote:
Gravity is not the reason there was a failure. It should work in any angle you place it, even upside down. I suspect there's something a little loose inside. I'd open it and verify every connection - that should resolve your issues.


Sorry McHale, we differ on this. My tests led me to conclude gravity was the
main factor. What solved my problem was laying the unit flat. And that was the only thing that solved it.

I could open it up to look for something loose. But what? And why?
I've got the unit working again. That was all I Wanted.

If there were an iPad app for the touchscreen, that would be a beautiful solution for this problem.
Korg should sell apps for its touch screen synths.
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McHale
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Joined: 10 Feb 2009
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 18, 2011 10:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

gurn wrote:
Sorry McHale, we differ on this. My tests led me to conclude gravity was the main factor. What solved my problem was laying the unit flat. And that was the only thing that solved it.


That's what worked on YOURS. Mine has been at a 45 degree angle (or more) since it was purchased new and I leave mine on for hours at a time. I've never had any of the problems you are having. If all connections are secure on the inside, you should be able to turn it upside down if you want to and use it. Of all of the thousands of M3's and M3M's sold, if this were a design flaw, we'd have heard of it by now... especially since the M3 is mounted at a 45 degree angle by default.
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dumeril7
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Joined: 15 May 2011
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Location: Austin, TX

PostPosted: Sun Sep 18, 2011 11:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

McHale wrote:
gurn wrote:
Sorry McHale, we differ on this. My tests led me to conclude gravity was the main factor. What solved my problem was laying the unit flat. And that was the only thing that solved it.


That's what worked on YOURS. Mine has been at a 45 degree angle (or more) since it was purchased new and I leave mine on for hours at a time. I've never had any of the problems you are having. If all connections are secure on the inside, you should be able to turn it upside down if you want to and use it. Of all of the thousands of M3's and M3M's sold, if this were a design flaw, we'd have heard of it by now... especially since the M3 is mounted at a 45 degree angle by default.


McHale, these guys are using theirs in rooms without air conditioning. I think the additional heat coupled with the angled position could be causing problems with the liquid membrane that covers the LCD. Age of the unit could also be a factor. Doesn't seem that far-fetched to me.

D7
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McHale
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 18, 2011 11:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dumeril7 wrote:
McHale, these guys are using theirs in rooms without air conditioning. I think the additional heat coupled with the angled position could be causing problems with the liquid membrane that covers the LCD. Age of the unit could also be a factor. Doesn't seem that far-fetched to me.


ANYTHING is possible. I don't think it's a design flaw though. The M3 doesn't generate a lot of heat and I believe the M3 is designed to work in pretty high temperatures, like 100+ degrees.

The 45 degree vs. horizontal thing is what has me concerned. I'd go inside and verify all the connections regardless. Only takes a second and at least gives the piece of mind that it ISN'T a connection problem. I'm really hoping it's not an age thing as well for obvious reasons or we'll all be seeing these issues over time.

It's too bad he lives so far from a service center, I'd like to hear what they find out with it.

-Mc
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dumeril7
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 18, 2011 11:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

McHale wrote:
dumeril7 wrote:
McHale, these guys are using theirs in rooms without air conditioning. I think the additional heat coupled with the angled position could be causing problems with the liquid membrane that covers the LCD. Age of the unit could also be a factor. Doesn't seem that far-fetched to me.


ANYTHING is possible. I don't think it's a design flaw though. The M3 doesn't generate a lot of heat and I believe the M3 is designed to work in pretty high temperatures, like 100+ degrees.

The 45 degree vs. horizontal thing is what has me concerned. I'd go inside and verify all the connections regardless. Only takes a second and at least gives the piece of mind that it ISN'T a connection problem. I'm really hoping it's not an age thing as well for obvious reasons or we'll all be seeing these issues over time.

It's too bad he lives so far from a service center, I'd like to hear what they find out with it.

-Mc


Connection problem doesn't seem likely to me because only a portion of the screen isn't working. Usually if there's a bad connection, its all or nothing. The chassis on my M3 gets pretty warm; not like my laptop, but still warmer than I'd like.

D7
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McHale
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 19, 2011 1:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

dumeril7 wrote:
Connection problem doesn't seem likely to me because only a portion of the screen isn't working.


I missed that part in the description. That is a good point.
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gurn
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 19, 2011 1:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

dumeril7 wrote:


Connection problem doesn't seem likely to me because only a portion of the screen isn't working. Usually if there's a bad connection, its all or nothing. The chassis on my M3 gets pretty warm; not like my laptop, but still warmer than I'd like.

D7


That's correct. In my case, the top right would fail. And I was unable to re-
calibrate the screen because the top left box had also failed. But the lower
area of the screen worked fine. And when I re-calibrated the lower black box
could be checked. But the upper box did not respond to touch.

Laying it flat solved the problem. The touch-screen failed only twice in 11 days - in high heat.
And both times I was able to re-calibrate to solve the problem.

And there have been a few people in this thread alone, reporting
the exact same problem - a failure in the top portion of the screen.
Two of us now have been able to solve the problem by changing the position of the M3m.

It would be wonderful to be able to bypass the touch-screen on the M3m.
An iPad controller would be exactly what the doctor ordered.
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Mad Warrior



Joined: 11 Aug 2007
Posts: 25
Location: Saint-Petersburg, Russia

PostPosted: Mon Sep 19, 2011 5:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

gurn wrote:
A hair dryer on touchscreen? That is interesting. Heating the screen w/hot air solves the problem? I wish I had thought of that.

Heating the screen while M3 is upside down.

May be there is such problem only on the older M3's? Serial number of mine is 444. Seems to be from the first produced units.
Gurn and McHale, what are your serials? Probably McHale has newer unit with another touchscreen? Or something?
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McHale
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 19, 2011 5:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mad Warrior wrote:
Gurn and McHale, what are your serials? Probably McHale has newer unit with another touchscreen? Or something?


Mine's 2373 (and is a 73 key)

But I've looked at the service manual and it doesn't differentiate any part numbers for the display. I'm also not aware of any service bulletins for the M3 display.
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gurn
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 19, 2011 9:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

McHale wrote:
Mad Warrior wrote:
Gurn and McHale, what are your serials? Probably McHale has newer unit with another touchscreen? Or something?


Mine's 2373 (and is a 73 key)

But I've looked at the service manual and it doesn't differentiate any part numbers for the display. I'm also not aware of any service bulletins for the M3 display.


00896R.

I bought this 'new other' from Guitar Factory NY on EBay. I have only had it
1 year. But is that a lower serial number than McHale's? Or higher?

I think some of these were returned and 'refurbished', then sold as new.
Also, I think a lot of dealers took M3's and expanded them in store. I'm not
complaining. I only paid $1100 for this thing. Best music gear purchase I've
made since I bought a 1990 Kawai K1 (in 1990).

I can't say this is a design defect. But it seems to be a problem for a lot of
owners. Maybe it was a manufacturing defect for a certain factory run of the
screens. I've heard the touch screens are made by SHARP.

Also,

1. Korg places the module at a safe angle when it comes w/the key bed. It's not nearly erect like ours.

2. The good news is - this is a serious problem that is easy to solve.

Follow the steps that Mad Warrior and I followed. It's easy & it works.

It's a shame because I really like it upright. It's a better position for me.
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madbeatzyo111
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 20, 2011 1:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hehe, I actually thought of the hairdryer idea before, but didn't want to be liable for melted LCD screens Wink But I'm glad Mad Warrior had the guts to try it. Basically the heat liquifies the conductive gel inside the touchscreen interface, thus giving enabling it to spread and fill any empty voids. I wouldn't consider it an M3 defect; it's more of a design flaw of that particular touchscreen overlay (resistive touchscreens are known for this failure mode). Possibly Korg used different sources throughout the manufaturing lifetime of the M3; thus some may have the problem and some do not.
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Pedro Collusso



Joined: 11 Jun 2009
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 03, 2011 3:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My M3 is suffering the same kind of disease... the right side of the display not responding to the touch, trying to calibrate the screen etc. This is the second time it happens. Then, after researching this thread and the one about the same subject at karma-Labs a few days ago I decided to leave my M3 more than 24 hours turned on (but not upside down) to see what would happen. Well, the touchscreen become responsive again and it is working fine the last few days. Go figure... My keyboard is from the non-Expanded M3 generation. It was upgraded after Korg released the Expansion software to all M3 owners. I wonder if those who have the factory expanded M3 are having the same problems or it just occurs to the originally non expanded ones.
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gurn
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 04, 2011 2:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pedro Collusso wrote:
My M3 is suffering the same kind of disease... the right side of the display not responding to the touch, trying to calibrate the screen etc. This is the second time it happens. Then, after researching this thread and the one about the same subject at karma-Labs a few days ago I decided to leave my M3 more than 24 hours turned on (but not upside down) to see what would happen. Well, the touchscreen become responsive again and it is working fine the last few days. Go figure... My keyboard is from the non-Expanded M3 generation. It was upgraded after Korg released the Expansion software to all M3 owners. I wonder if those who have the factory expanded M3 are having the same problems or it just occurs to the originally non expanded ones.


Interesting.

This is a very common problem. There must have been a large run of bad touch-screens on the M3.

I have not tried leaving it on w/o turning it over. My problem was concentrated in the top right part of the screen though, not on the entire right side.

It still happens on my M3m. But not as often now.
When I turn it on -- I immediately calibrate the screen.

What we all have in common is that leaving it turned on for many hours seems to help.
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my2sons8791



Joined: 22 Dec 2006
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PostPosted: Tue Jul 31, 2012 2:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Same problem here as gurn. Top of screen (very top corners) cannot be activated. Bottom is fine. My M3 stays in a climate controlled room at the tilted angle allowed by the mounts on the board and has not been subjected to high levels of heat or humidity. Has anyone spoken to Korg to get an official answer? Laying it flat is not a solution in my book. Bottom line....it doesn't perform the way it is designed to. It may be isolated to a certain batch of touch screens but at the end of the day, Korg produced the entire package and they should make this right. I am a long-time Korg user and I have had virtually no issues with my older Korg gear. I love the M3, but the touch screen issue really takes the joy out of this keyboard.
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drama1
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 01, 2012 1:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is what has worked for me. I can't believe it because I have tried everything on the forum, hair dryer, cleaning out the edges of the screen, turning the board upside down. I have been scouring for a used m3m in my area because I'm booked the rest of the summer and I have no time to reprogram another board. Everyone having a problem with your screen try calibrating your pads and then your screen. My screen hasn't worked properly in a month. The bottom right side of the screen did not work and I could not get the square box in the lower right-hand corner to touch to black. For the hell of it I calibrated my pads and now everything works. Very Happy I can now calibrate my screen. I can't imagine what this has to do with it, but so far it worked for me. Hope it works for all you.
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