m3 hmmmmmmmmmm, !!!??!!

[Alone]

Well, went to GC and checked out the m3 coz I got tired of fantasizing about it. HAHAHHAH!!!!

but i was disapointed, i was not impress at all with the m3, WHY? that's coz maybe i used to own the triton classic then stuido and now I won the Extreme, the m3 has great quality sound, but c'mon, i didn't see or hear anything that would WOW me into buying one at the moment. Seems like most of the voices are the same from the Triton series.

Im not sure coz i don't really know how to use the m3 yet, but it seems to have less voices than the extreme, plus I didn't know how to get to the arppreggios, a very important feature for me.

If anyone can tell me how many arppeggios there are and if they r any different from the triton series, please let me know.

...........but 1 thing that I really like is the Mongolian Voice,

[cminor]

1. 320MB sampling (I think they add a "0" to the triton's RAM).
2.The number of user program are? yes, your actual number on the triton is 4x128, and on the M3 are 6 I + 7 U *even the Internal (I) programs can be modified.
3. and the most important thing to me: - the LIVE setup.
The complexity of the LIVE setup that can be made, makes the Triton a toy.
The combination with Pads on different MIDI channels, KARMA system, the Internal/External sets for the faders Controllers, not to mention the X Motion, makes the M3 a LIVE Beast.

I was angry too when I saw that the M3 have almost the same sounds as my old Triton, but then I realize that combined with EXB-Radias it can be much more...
Even if it doesn't have the "power", or the "richness" of my old Fantom-XR, it can be saved with a little work and sampling.

[Gargamel314]

Seems like most of the voices are the same from the Triton series.

I kinda saw this as a plus, since I knew I could depend on the M3 in every way I depended on my Triton Extreme. These programs do sound pretty different from the Tritons, even though they fulfill the same roles.

If anyone can tell me how many arppeggios there are and if they r any different from the triton series, please let me know.

M3 doesn't have an arpeggiator, it has something called KARMA. KARMA can do arpeggios, but the only way you can program them the way you want is if you have it hooked up to proprietary software (you have to buy it). the M3 has 162 arpeggio Karma GE's programmed into it, I don't know how they compare to what's in the Triton, I'm sure some are similar, and some are very different. You can adjust some of the settings from the M3's interface, but it's not at all like the Triton's programmable arpeggiators.

[Synthoid]

but i was disapointed, i was not impress at all with the m3, WHY? that's coz maybe i used to own the triton classic

You can't truly appreciate the sounds and features of the M3 from a whirlwind visit to the music store. The M3 is far more complex than the Triton series... I still own a Triton Classic and was amazed by the M3.

What really makes the M3 stand out is the KARMA feature--much deeper than standard arps. Many people play a few of the M3's KARMA combinations and say something like, "that won't work for me" and walk away. Obviously it takes time to explore and understand KARMA, but it offers endless rhythmic and textural possibilities.

[midinut]

but i was disapointed, i was not impress at all with the m3, WHY? that's coz maybe i used to own the triton classic

You can't truly appreciate the sounds and features of the M3 from a whirlwind visit to the music store. The M3 is far more complex than the Triton series... I still own a Triton Classic and was amazed by the M3.

What really makes the M3 stand out is the KARMA feature--much deeper than standard arps. Many people play a few of the M3's KARMA combinations and say something like, "that won't work for me" and walk away. Obviously it takes time to explore and understand KARMA, but it offers endless rhythmic and textural possibilities.

What he said...

Well said BTW Synthoid! I couldn't have said it better myself. I can do this to them though...

http://www.korg.de/?popup=9785&no_cache=1

[Alone]

M3 doesn't have an arpeggiator, it has something called KARMA. KARMA can do arpeggios, but the only way you can program them the way you want is if you have it hooked up to proprietary software (you have to buy it). the M3 has 162 arpeggio Karma GE's programmed into it, I don't know how they compare to what's in the Triton, I'm sure some are similar, and some are very different. You can adjust some of the settings from the M3's interface, but it's not at all like the Triton's programmable arpeggiators.

Well, i don't own a Karma and never did so I have no idea what it can do.
but the 162 Karma arpeggios, can they be use in the SEQuencer mode, ... like on a track?

[cminor]

Alone, you must be confused by the name of "Karma".
M3 Karma http://www.karma-lab.com/karmasoft/m3/m3_main.html is not this Karma http://www.mexthai.com/shop/m/mexthai/i ... 0625_b.JPG

[Synthoid]

Well, i don't own a Karma and never did so I have no idea what it can do. but the 162 Karma arpeggios, can they be use in the SEQuencer mode, ... like on a track?

Yes... KARMA is quite versatile.

[BasariStudios]

M3 doesnt have 162 GEs but it has well over 1500 GEs i think.

[Gargamel314]

yeah, the "162 GE's" was in reference to the arpeggio GE's... yeah, i think there are over 2000 GE's in total, which can do strumming, improvisation, guitar picking, wavesequencing, drum patterning, etc.... way more on there than just arpeggios.

Alone, check out this article on Korg's website, spend some time on the M3 doing some of the stuff they call for: http://www.korg.com/ClassDetail.aspx?ID=37

[Alone]

OK, I think I got it. Saw a video on Youtube.

So it's like arpeggiator and an auto-accompaniment device. kind of like an arranger keyboard. Correct me if I'm wrong.


Questions:

...and with the software, I can creat my own also and/or edit existing ones and then transfer them back into the m3 keybrd & save ?


...and all these cool karma features can be use in the Sequencer mode or just for LIVE playing?

[Shakil]

Alone.... yes basically it's highly advanced arpeggiator system with 4 engines, 8 scenes with 40 options and each scene can have 16 parameters. The arp notes/style is not fixed, it is dynamic, alive, organic, algorithmic.... BUT it's not an arranger, because the patterns are limited by note numbers.

[orpheus2006]

BUT it's not an arranger, because the patterns are limited by note numbers.

Not sure what you are meaning?

While an arranger (or auto-accompaniment device) is designed to replay pre-defined note phrases, KARMA is more an experimental and inspirational tool.

The output i.e. MIDI data generated by a KARMA module is influenced by the actual GE parameter values. You can (theoretically) create 128^8 + 2^8 = 7.2 * 10^16 variations by just using the 8 sliders and buttons, and store a snapshot of the actual settings in one of the 8 scenes. In practice, only a small fraction of all these combinations sounds musical, but still you have a lot of possibilities to influence the KARMA engine. Using the sliders and buttons you can change things like rhythm, note duration, velocity, choose between different phrases, choose between different note maps, and so forth.
Since you have 2000+ GEs, the number of possible variations is even bigger (1.4 * 10^20). And this little math exercise was done for just 1 KARMA module; in a combi you can have up to 4 KARMA modules running in parallel. Endless possibilities you cannot explore in a lifetime.

Both, a typical arranger and KARMA, are note generating (or to be more precise: MIDI data generating) engines. The difference is how you control these engines. One common input are the notes/chords you are playing which is analyzed by the engine's chord recognition system to transpose (or otherwise adjust) the generated notes. Also common is the possibility to choose the instrument (=program, voice) that actually plays the generated notes.
But while you say to an arranger "play this phrase, intro, verse, ending, etc.", the KARMA engine reacts to commands such as "increase the note density, add swing to your groove, decrease the average note length, add a pitch bending effect to the notes played, and so on".

You need some learning time before you can "drive" this KARMA beast, but you will be amply rewarded with fresh, unique, and great sounding music. Make sure to visit karma-lab.com where you can find a WIKI, forum, tutorials to get your "KARMA driver license".
(there is no such license, but maybe it would be a good idea to implement a kind of qualification process?!)

Disadvantage of KARMA: if you want KARMA to replay an exact note phrase, you cannot just define/enter the notes and their durations, but you would need to adjust the sliders and buttons so the generated phrase matches the note phrase you have in mind. Given the many possibilities (see calculation above), this is (in practice) impossible to achieve.
Remark: The optional available KARMA M3 software allows you to import phrases (MIDI notes). But be warned, I experienced that during the import the original material is slightly altered e.g. notes are quantized, some notes may get dropped, so the imported result is not always satisfying.

Advantage of KARMA: it generates fresh, unique and unheared musical phrases.
Note: sometimes the result is just garbage (from a musical point of view). So another control instance is needed: your ears! Initially you will create more garbage than good results, and that's the reason why you can't truly appreciate the sounds of the M3 from a visit to the music store.
This problem does not exist with arrangers because they just replay pre-defined (usually well-sounding) phrases.

[Shakil]

Shakil wrote:
BUT it's not an arranger, because the patterns are limited by note numbers.

Not sure what you are meaning?

What I mean is that each GE pattern is limited to a number of notes (I don't remember exactly), sine KARMA processes note by note.

In an arranger keyboard, the styles/patterns can have any number of notes.

[/quote]

[Synthoid]

...and all these cool karma features can be use in the Sequencer mode or just for LIVE playing?

Yes!