Davd C. Polich wrote:
I prefer to consider it as an awesome FM synth with a sample-playback engine thrown in.
I partially agree here.
I agree with you, outboard sequencing is so much better and easier than working on the little screen of a workstation.
I think it'll be only a matter of time until Korg ditches this one as well due to cost/efficiency of implementation, in my opinion ofc.
I partially agree here. Due to cost/efficiency of implementation, Korg will also ditch RH3/standard keys for mini keys.
Mini keys are so much easier to use, reduces overall weight. IMO
They will also brilliantly remove all the surface controls, knobs, controllers since they are replaced by an app for your smart phone. IMO, ofc
by cost/efficiency I mean the fact that people hardly use the feature. the cost of maintaining a feature that only a fraction of the users use is high. People would've have bought the Kronos without the RH3. but I'd guess they would've bought it without a full blown sequencer on board. trust me, in a few years - you'll see those fade away, just because people hardly use it. ofcourse the Korg forum is NOT a representative community for this claim though but professionals these days use DAWs exclusively. let's return to this thread in a few years time.
I agree with you, outboard sequencing is so much better and easier than working on the little screen of a workstation.
I think it'll be only a matter of time until Korg ditches this one as well due to cost/efficiency of implementation, in my opinion ofc.
I partially agree here. Due to cost/efficiency of implementation, Korg will also ditch RH3/standard keys for mini keys.
Mini keys are so much easier to use, reduces overall weight. IMO
They will also brilliantly remove all the surface controls, knobs, controllers since they are replaced by an app for your smart phone. IMO, ofc
by cost/efficiency I mean the fact that people hardly use the feature. the cost of maintaining a feature that only a fraction of the users use is high. People would've have bought the Kronos without the RH3. but I'd guess they would've bought it without a full blown sequencer on board. trust me, in a few years - you'll see those fade away, just because people hardly use it. ofcourse the Korg forum is NOT a representative community for this claim though but professionals these days use DAWs exclusively. let's return to this thread in a few years time.
what % of the ' market ' is "professional; " ?
Yamaha could also force the change by simply removing the SEQ. They figure they can overcome initial griping by the % of MOtifers who relied on the built in SEQ. And push them over to whatever DAW Yamaha wants to further peddle.
I won't even consider the Montage since it has no SEQ. I am spoiled by the Kronos.
street wrote:
by cost/efficiency I mean the fact that people hardly use the feature. the cost of maintaining a feature that only a fraction of the users use is high. People would've have bought the Kronos without the RH3. but I'd guess they would've bought it without a full blown sequencer on board. trust me, in a few years - you'll see those fade away, just because people hardly use it. ofcourse the Korg forum is NOT a representative community for this claim though but professionals these days use DAWs exclusively. let's return to this thread in a few years time.
Hey, I use the onboard sequencer!
Don't forget that Korg invented the workstation concept, and they may not walk away from it quickly. Apart from anything it's a market differentiator.
Current Equipment:
Korg Kronos 2 88, Reface CS, Roland JV-1080, TE OP1, Moog Subsequent 37, Korg ARP Odyssey, Allen & Heath Zed 18, Adam F5, MOTU MIDI Express XT, Lexicon MX200 & MPX1, Yamaha QY700, Yamaha AW16G, Tascam DP008ex, Zoom H6, Organelle, Roland J6 & JU06A
Previous: Triton LE 61/Sampling/64MB/4GB SCSI, MS2000BR, Kronos 1 61, Monotribe, NanoKontrol, NanoKeys, Kaossilator II, Casio HT3000, Roland VP-03, Reface DX, Novation Mininova, MPC One
street wrote:
by cost/efficiency I mean the fact that people hardly use the feature. the cost of maintaining a feature that only a fraction of the users use is high. People would've have bought the Kronos without the RH3. but I'd guess they would've bought it without a full blown sequencer on board. trust me, in a few years - you'll see those fade away, just because people hardly use it. ofcourse the Korg forum is NOT a representative community for this claim though but professionals these days use DAWs exclusively. let's return to this thread in a few years time.
Hey, I use the onboard sequencer!
Don't forget that Korg invented the workstation concept, and they may not walk away from it quickly. Apart from anything it's a market differentiator.
thats good knowledge.
And Korg revived the declining workstation market with the Kronos.
GregC wrote:
I partially agree here. Due to cost/efficiency of implementation, Korg will also ditch RH3/standard keys for mini keys.
Mini keys are so much easier to use, reduces overall weight. IMO
They will also brilliantly remove all the surface controls, knobs, controllers since they are replaced by an app for your smart phone. IMO, ofc
by cost/efficiency I mean the fact that people hardly use the feature. the cost of maintaining a feature that only a fraction of the users use is high. People would've have bought the Kronos without the RH3. but I'd guess they would've bought it without a full blown sequencer on board. trust me, in a few years - you'll see those fade away, just because people hardly use it. ofcourse the Korg forum is NOT a representative community for this claim though but professionals these days use DAWs exclusively. let's return to this thread in a few years time.
what % of the ' market ' is "professional; " ?
Yamaha could also force the change by simply removing the SEQ. They figure they can overcome initial griping by the % of MOtifers who relied on the built in SEQ. And push them over to whatever DAW Yamaha wants to further peddle.
I won't even consider the Montage since it has no SEQ. I am spoiled by the Kronos.
Also, those manufacturers know very well that while there are people who do not use onboard sequencers there are those who depend on it. Who's to say who's who? 85% basement producers who don't know how to program it and use a free copy of a DAW and 15% pros in a studio who swear by it. Ignore those 15% 'cause they're a minority? No way Yamaha or Korg will totally abandon the segment but weirder things have happened. Blackberry moving to Android...at least they're trying to survive.
People enjoy things differently. I remember when I first opened my Motif ES box back in 2004. I stood there scared to touch it and just enjoyed the view. I thought I could compose just by looking at it without ever turning it on. Took months before I plugged it into a computer. It was me and the instrument. Intimately. The way it should be!
I've never seen or heard a Pultec but desperately want one!
aron wrote:>I already knew Kronos is superior sound wise and this was never an issue.
It is different. It is not all "superior". It depends on what _you_ like.
Believe me, there are probably going to be lots of sounds that you will miss from your Motif. Some sounds of the Motif fit well in the live band context much better than the Kronos (stock sounds). The Kronos is amazing once you work with it, but out of the box, for me, it required a lot of work.
Well, I still think that Kronos is far ahead of Motif sound wise regardless how subjective this may be. Back in the day, when I already had my ES, I demoed Oasys and felt sorry for my Motif. There are some fantastic sounds on the Motif and the fact that it is the best fit for more acoustically oriented genre. Roland on the other hand has never been an option for me since they bundle the same overused synth sounds over and over. Kronos is the best of both worlds and poses an acceptable compromise when I consider my needs. Don't mind taking a lot of work out of the box either.
I've never seen or heard a Pultec but desperately want one!
kday wrote:I have a Motif XF and the Kronos too. They both are two different beast.
The Korg is better overall as it has a much better sampler, and 9 nine different synth engines. Need i say more?
The Kronos is top of the line workstation with different synthesizers onboard, the Motif XF is more like a great Rompler with very complex sampling capabilities and and probably a good sequencer, I don't use it.
The Montage sorta failed the workstation department, because that's what they wanted to design, a synthesizer and not a full blown workstation.
But Yamaha will upgrade the OS in a few years to turn it into a full blown workstation with a full blown sequencer and sampling capabilities in the future in sure. They may release a new workstation with full blown workstation capabilities and an OS update for current owners, or just an OS update for the current model.
It's a two tier sales program that these synth manufactures are employing to add revenue in selling two different synthesizers.
Korg did that with the Kronos. They sold a shoddy cheap scratchy plastic version of the Kronos in the beginning and then introduced the real version with wood side panels and better built electronics with an OS upgrade after they got everybody to buy the first cheap version first.
Yamaha is doing the same, they're selling a limited function version of the montage, and then they'll introduce a full blown version after they get everybody to buy this model first. Guaranteed.
LMBO. THIS IS WRONG ON SOOOOO MANY LEVELS
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2045 : my girl has her heart directly connected (with ¥sync7) on KISS (Korg Interplanetary Sound System). Actually her last ET (Earth Tune) is number 3 on Vega and has reveived an Özæ prize in Alpha Centauri. So cute !.
Well I am playing the Montage tonight in concert and this keyboard sounds like a high end flagship keyboard. It sounds incredible and piano sound is amazing. I can't stop playing it because of the range and sensitivity.
It is extremely clear and the sounds are so vibrant. Yep.
Korg Kronos, RD-88, Yamaha VL1, Deep Mind 6, Korg Kross, author of unrealBook for iPad.
kday wrote:
It's a two tier sales program that these synth manufactures are employing to add revenue in selling two different synthesizers.
Korg did that with the Kronos. They sold a shoddy cheap scratchy plastic version of the Kronos in the beginning and then introduced the real version with wood side panels and better built electronics with an OS upgrade after they got everybody to buy the first cheap version first.
I wouldn't call it cheap scratchy plastic ... I have the first version Kronos for about 5 years, and with like 50 gigs and weekly moving back and forth to the rehearsal room it still performs as day 1 (actually better with a smal hardware upgrade and many software upgrades and sound libraries).
aron wrote:Well I am playing the Montage tonight in concert and this keyboard sounds like a high end flagship keyboard. It sounds incredible and piano sound is amazing. I can't stop playing it because of the range and sensitivity.
It is extremely clear and the sounds are so vibrant. Yep.
All this talk about the Montage made me go ahead and get me one last week. And so far I'm really like the board! The sound is clear and amazing!
aron wrote:Well I am playing the Montage tonight in concert and this keyboard sounds like a high end flagship keyboard. It sounds incredible and piano sound is amazing. I can't stop playing it because of the range and sensitivity.
It is extremely clear and the sounds are so vibrant. Yep.
All this talk about the Montage made me go ahead and get me one last week. And so far I'm really like the board! The sound is clear and amazing!
Update it to 1.11 and check out these new TX816 e. pianos - incredible!
The Montage is super sensitive. So dynamic in many levels that the motif didn't do for me. The FM Is silky smooth and the entire board is extremely big sounding. The orchestral sounds are amazing - played it in concert and wow!
Korg Kronos, RD-88, Yamaha VL1, Deep Mind 6, Korg Kross, author of unrealBook for iPad.
aron wrote:Well I am playing the Montage tonight in concert and this keyboard sounds like a high end flagship keyboard. It sounds incredible and piano sound is amazing. I can't stop playing it because of the range and sensitivity.
It is extremely clear and the sounds are so vibrant. Yep.
All this talk about the Montage made me go ahead and get me one last week. And so far I'm really like the board! The sound is clear and amazing!
Update it to 1.11 and check out these new TX816 e. pianos - incredible!
It was undated when I got it, Got it cheep used for a good price! But I will be checking out all the new patches!
Thanks!
