kronos - mellotron?

[korglifeguy]

Im sure this has probably been answered somewhere but I cant find it. Does the Kronos offer mellotron emulations (choirs mainly) and if so which synth engine of the kronos are they found in?

[JimH]

Im sure this has probably been answered somewhere but I cant find it. Does the Kronos offer mellotron emulations (choirs mainly) and if so which synth engine of the kronos are they found in?

It does have some mellotron sounds. In the videos so far I've heard them play flute and strings. I assume these sounds are in the built-in Expansion PCM library EXs4 - Vintage Keyboards. That means it's the HD-1 engine. I'm not aware that there is any voice list available yet; as far as I know this is a new-for-Kronos library. So I don't know if the choirs are included. (But how could they not! )

[Scott]

You'd also have the option of loading more mellotron sounds into it yourself. You can buy some at http://www.Vintagekeyboardsounds.com/

[EXer]

Why should we have to buy Mellotron samples?

A high end general purpose workstation should have them included in the factory waveforms. When you buy a Kronos you're not buying an empty sampler.

[Bertotti]

Granted I am a newb but to me the Kronos is anything but empty.

[Citizen Klaus]

Why should we have to buy Mellotron samples?

A high end general purpose workstation should have them included in the factory waveforms. When you buy a Kronos you're not buying an empty sampler.

Well, they'll probably have the famous standards -- strings, flute, and maybe cello.

But if you want some of the more obscure Mellotron sounds (mandolin, anyone?), you'll probably need to sample them yourself.

[medusaland]

Im sure this has probably been answered somewhere but I cant find it. Does the Kronos offer mellotron emulations (choirs mainly) and if so which synth engine of the kronos are they found in?

Hi Folks,

Please take a look at this link...

http://karo-sounds.com/web/km400_e.html

Best Regards,

Kurt
KARO sound development

[Akos Janca]

Just a note, Kronos has a mellotron sound in the HD-1 engine (= based on samples), it's called "tape strings" or similar.

Holding down the keys the sound stops after 8 (?) seconds, similarly to the original magnetic tapes.

[billbaker]

EXer wrote: "A high end general purpose workstation should have them included in the factory waveforms."

Well, yes and no.

For their day, Melotron's tape-sample technology was great - 8 seconds of a given sound; string ens, flute, choir... etc. They were as close to real as a keyboardist could get. The mellotron was the monster under the bed for string players everywhere; "If these things catch on we'll never get another gig". Well... the samples 're good, but they're not that great. They all start at A and play to Z, a limitation of the technology used to play the tape samples. They have wonderful character, but that sound is absolutely carved in stone.

A high-end general purpose workstation today sounds way better if realism (the whole point of Mellotron's technology) is what your after -- that's a realistic expectation of a high end ROM-pler or synth.

A ROM-pler dedicated to vintage keyboards, yeah, I would expect to see the big 3, choir, strings, flute there -- and did in things like the EMU Classic Keys module, the Roland Classic Keys SRX and Korg's Vintage Keys EXB.

But on high-end flagship synths? If they are in there at all it's as an afterthought, and probably as emulations using, truthfully, better string sounds and the compression, tape noise, flanging and other audible artifacts that give the Mellotron much of it's character sound.

All of that'll likely be in Kronos, probably under HD-1, but I'd bet it's not with true Mellotron sample(s) used.



BB

[burningbusch]

You can hear choir, flute, strings in this video (audio quality is not particularly good):

Kronos Mellotron

These are supposed to be the "eight second long" samples so I have to assume they sampled a Mellotron without loops, which is pretty straightforward as there are no velocity layers and it's a direct mono source.

Busch.

[billbaker]

Busch,

OK, those sound like pretty good mellotron sounds... still, something of a niche sound unless you're in a tribute band.

As I said, not surprised the sounds are there, but that they used the amount of sample time required for 8 second unlooped multisamples of 3 instruments?... that sounds to me like diminishing returns.

I believe this was the HD-1 portion of the presentation; and I can believe that new HD-1 Mellotron emulation programs were written, perhaps to a level of detail that would include the 8 second tape stop.

But I, for one, would be disappointed to hear that Korg wasted more than minimal memory resources on these voices when you could squeeze in a huge number of vintage synth or drum waves into the same space.


BB

[X-Trade]

Actually mellotron sounds are increasingly popular particularly in new prog and ambient-ish rock bands. It is a vintage sound like the minimoog or hammond organ.

I particularly love those sounds. Hopefully there are looped versions too though, as they really can be used to add a nice quality to real orchestral patches as they have a very special character.

[BillW]

Actually mellotron sounds are increasingly popular particularly in new prog and ambient-ish rock bands. It is a vintage sound like the minimoog or hammond organ.

I particularly love those sounds. Hopefully there are looped versions too though, as they really can be used to add a nice quality to real orchestral patches as they have a very special character.

I even use them in my 70s/80s cover band. If you look the posted Kronos documentation for EXs5, there are several Mellotron waveforms in there:

0000 Tape 3 Violins 1
0001 Tape 3 Violins 2
0002 Tape 16 Violins
0003 Tape Mixed Strings
0004 Tape Brass
0005 Tape Strings+Brass
0006 Tape Flute
0007 Tape 8 Voice Choir
0008 Tape Boys Choir

[burningbusch]

Busch,


As I said, not surprised the sounds are there, but that they used the amount of sample time required for 8 second unlooped multisamples of 3 instruments?... that sounds to me like diminishing returns.

I believe this was the HD-1 portion of the presentation; and I can believe that new HD-1 Mellotron emulation programs were written, perhaps to a level of detail that would include the 8 second tape stop.

But I, for one, would be disappointed to hear that Korg wasted more than minimal memory resources on these voices when you could squeeze in a huge number of vintage synth or drum waves into the same space.


BB

If I did my calculations correctly, I figure about 9.2MB for each instrument. This assumes: three octaves, every third note sampled, 8 seconds, mono, one velocity layer. Remember this is really only space on the SSD --27MB of the 30GB disk and a tiny amount of RAM for preload.

Busch.

[Scott]

But I, for one, would be disappointed to hear that Korg wasted more than minimal memory resources on these voices when you could squeeze in a huge number of vintage synth or drum waves into the same space.

The whole point of the Kronos is to get away from the traditional restraints of "minimal memory resources." There's a 30 gB drive in there! If you don't want the mellotron sounds, and you want other sounds instead, just don't load the mellotron sounds, and free up the space for other sounds.

Personally, with all the resources at the Kronos' disposal, having made the decision to include mellotron sounds at all, I would be disappointed if they did NOT include each of the 35 notes at the full 8 seconds sampled, with no stretching, no looping. The last thing we need on a high end workstation is another bunch of adequate-at-best mellotron patches like everyone else has, where they lose much of the original character by not including complete samples. Why bother? These are the limitations the Kronos is designed to end.