I must be missing something . . .

OldDude · Post by **OldDude** » Fri Jun 08, 2012 5:00 pm

I've only just begun to even look into the possibilities of this incredible device having previously just sat down found a pleasant piano or EP to tinkle on and had a go.

Now that I'm looking at what all is really there (just in the presets so far), I'm finding I can't find some things that I know must be there.

In the hundreds of drum patterns, for instance, the doesn't seem to be a straight up Bossa or much in the way of traditional Latin rhythms at all.

What am I missing?

CaptLego · Post by **CaptLego** » Fri Jun 08, 2012 8:20 pm

I had the same problem. There are a few Latin beats in there...but not much. I found some Latin drum MIDI files, but haven't yet learned how to load those as drum patterns.

ed_f · Post by **ed_f** » Sat Jun 09, 2012 1:03 am

Loading midis drum patterns in and getting them in the user drum patterns is pretty easy, a couple steps and once you have done it, you have lots of slots you can fill up. I spent a day doing it awhile back.

The manual explains it well, I have a whole section of latin stuff myself.

OldDude · Post by **OldDude** » Sat Jun 09, 2012 1:39 am

Thanks. I guess I can go find some appropriate midi stuff somewhere and load it.

I guess I was just expecting to find the bread-and-butter standards in the presets -- especially given the number of presets provided.

As much as I appreciate a broadened horizon and being pushed out of my comfort zone, I still very much rely on that safety net that you can depend upon.

jeremykeys · Post by **jeremykeys** » Tue Jun 12, 2012 12:25 am

I understand your problem. Sometimes I'm looking for very basic rock drum patterns and I can't find them either.
That and sometimes the kick is too loud or the h-'hat not loud enough.

StephenKay · Post by **StephenKay** » Tue Jun 12, 2012 3:09 am

jeremykeys wrote:I understand your problem. Sometimes I'm looking for very basic rock drum patterns and I can't find them either.
That and sometimes the kick is too loud or the h-'hat not loud enough.

Zone the kit on several timbres, such that one timbre plays only the kick. Turn down that timbre. Many KARMA combis use multiple timbres for the Drum groove, even though it may be only on one MIDI channel. Through key-zoning, you can lower parts of the groove, or substitute a different drum kit for just the hi-hats (example). You could have electronic hi-hats from one kit, while the rest of the groove is played by an acoustic kit.

apex · Post by **apex** » Tue Jun 12, 2012 3:47 am

StephenKay wrote: Zone the kit on several timbres, such that one timbre plays only the kick. Turn down that timbre. Many KARMA combis use multiple timbres for the Drum groove, even though it may be only on one MIDI channel. Through key-zoning, you can lower parts of the groove, or substitute a different drum kit for just the hi-hats (example). You could have electronic hi-hats from one kit, while the rest of the groove is played by an acoustic kit.

explain please.

StephenKay · Post by **StephenKay** » Tue Jun 12, 2012 7:11 am

apex wrote:
StephenKay wrote: Zone the kit on several timbres, such that one timbre plays only the kick. Turn down that timbre. Many KARMA combis use multiple timbres for the Drum groove, even though it may be only on one MIDI channel. Through key-zoning, you can lower parts of the groove, or substitute a different drum kit for just the hi-hats (example). You could have electronic hi-hats from one kit, while the rest of the groove is played by an acoustic kit.
explain please.

OK. Assign 3 Drum Kits to 3 timbres. Assign them all to the same MIDI channel. Then, use the Timbre Key Zone parameters to "chop up" the zones so that different notes go to different timbres. This is a common technique in the factory voicing.

Example. Assuming the drum groove is playing C2 for kick, you set one timbre to have a key zone of C2 and down. Now, it only plays the kick. You might then set another timbre (on the same MIDI channel) to key zone from C#2 to E2. Now that timbre plays the snares and sidestick. Assign the third key zone to be from F2 and up. It will play the rest of the kit (hi-hats, toms, percussion). You have now split those three timbres. (I hope I got the note designations right, I'm a little confused recently since Korg and Yamaha differ on which octave is middle C.)

Three timbres, on the same MIDI channel, but each responds to only a portion of the range of notes. Get it?

You could have a different drum kit assigned to the timbre that is zoned F2 and up. It could be playing electronic hi-hats.....

SanderXpander · Post by **SanderXpander** » Tue Jun 12, 2012 7:26 am

They were talking about drum track, not Karma. Good suggestion none the less.

jeremykeys · Post by **jeremykeys** » Tue Jun 12, 2012 11:31 am

Thanks SK> a quick question.
Are the drum tracks played through Karma if you only press the drum track button? I'm wondering what is driving them.

X-Trade · Post by **X-Trade** » Tue Jun 12, 2012 6:56 pm

The drum track is effectively just a short drum loop. No KARMA, although it can be tied in with KARMA's latch and quantise functions..

This method can still be used for drum tracks in a combi because the 'drum track' is simply transmitting MIDI notes on a specific channel. Just assign a few timbres to that same channel.
Also a useful method to mix/match drum sounds and FX routings. I'd have never dreamt of doing it on the Triton/Karma because there are only 8 timbres but with 16, it is more than enough.

Shakil · Post by **Shakil** » Tue Jun 12, 2012 8:42 pm

StephenKay wrote:
apex wrote:
StephenKay wrote: Zone the kit on several timbres, such that one timbre plays only the kick. Turn down that timbre. Many KARMA combis use multiple timbres for the Drum groove, even though it may be only on one MIDI channel. Through key-zoning, you can lower parts of the groove, or substitute a different drum kit for just the hi-hats (example). You could have electronic hi-hats from one kit, while the rest of the groove is played by an acoustic kit.
explain please.
OK. Assign 3 Drum Kits to 3 timbres. Assign them all to the same MIDI channel. Then, use the Timbre Key Zone parameters to "chop up" the zones so that different notes go to different timbres. This is a common technique in the factory voicing.

Example. Assuming the drum groove is playing C2 for kick, you set one timbre to have a key zone of C2 and down. Now, it only plays the kick. You might then set another timbre (on the same MIDI channel) to key zone from C#2 to E2. Now that timbre plays the snares and sidestick. Assign the third key zone to be from F2 and up. It will play the rest of the kit (hi-hats, toms, percussion). You have now split those three timbres. (I hope I got the note designations right, I'm a little confused recently since Korg and Yamaha differ on which octave is middle C.)

Three timbres, on the same MIDI channel, but each responds to only a portion of the range of notes. Get it?

You could have a different drum kit assigned to the timbre that is zoned F2 and up. It could be playing electronic hi-hats.....

That's nice... Since different timbres are used for kicks/snare/hats.. you can route them to different IFXs for processing and mixing....... The above technique also applies to drum track... and it's actually better with drum track, because you can have your own patterns.

But on some other workstations I can not only substitute drums sounds on a key, but also edit them right from the sequencer or combi/performance.. for example sending more reverb on the snare, alternate pan the hi-hats, filter the kick... random pan the tamborine between 11 and 1'o clock.... etc...

SanderXpander · Post by **SanderXpander** » Tue Jun 12, 2012 9:47 pm

I'm sorry, I seem to have misread Stephen's very useful and informative post, which makes my previous comment sound condescending. That's a really good tip, Stephen!