amplifying the m50

xmlguy · Post by **xmlguy** » Thu Jul 22, 2010 5:11 am

A powered mixer is often cheaper to buy, but could be more expensive in the long run if you accidently blow up the speakers because there's no built-in protection from doing so. It's also usually a poor value for what you get because powered speakers have better components for the price, like a better amplifier, neodymium drivers, better HF horn compression driver, etc., among the other benefits I mentioned previously. Powered mixers were a better value 10+ years ago before powered speakers became widely available at reasonable prices. Things have changed since then.

Just to be clear, I'm not saying that powered mixers are necessarily a bad option, particularly the ones like those mentioned by other people in this thread if it suits their purposes well, such as the better StagePas systems. Yamaha makes some very nice gear. The StagePas is well engineered as a system. The StagePas is integrated better than a typical powered mixer + speakers that you buy separately. There are many people who are perfectly satisfied with their existing powered mixers and speakers, so mostly I'm talking about their benefits and drawbacks for a new purchase. If you find a good used powered mixer and speakers for a value price, then you can still end up with a good result too.

dekturrr · Post by **dekturrr** » Thu Jul 22, 2010 5:34 pm

thanks,

i think i will stay with my current setup then, that is, a mixer with a powered speaker.

holdsg · Post by **holdsg** » Thu Jul 22, 2010 9:40 pm

xmlguy wrote:A powered mixer is often cheaper to buy, but could be more expensive in the long run if you accidently blow up the speakers because there's no built-in protection from doing so. It's also usually a poor value for what you get because powered speakers have better components for the price, like a better amplifier, neodymium drivers, better HF horn compression driver, etc., among the other benefits I mentioned previously. Powered mixers were a better value 10+ years ago before powered speakers became widely available at reasonable prices. Things have changed since then.

Just to be clear, I'm not saying that powered mixers are necessarily a bad option, particularly the ones like those mentioned by other people in this thread if it suits their purposes well, such as the better StagePas systems. Yamaha makes some very nice gear. The StagePas is well engineered as a system. The StagePas is integrated better than a typical powered mixer + speakers that you buy separately. There are many people who are perfectly satisfied with their existing powered mixers and speakers, so mostly I'm talking about their benefits and drawbacks for a new purchase. If you find a good used powered mixer and speakers for a value price, then you can still end up with a good result too.

Good info xlrguy, can tell you're experienced in this area. I have gained "experience" through trial and error, and wished I had your wisdom prior to some of the errors. Yep, this thread should be required reading for any Korg-ite (or is it Korg-anism?) seeking to play live.

mocando · Post by **mocando** » Thu Jul 22, 2010 10:05 pm

Another good thing about passive mixers is, you can use the same mixer with all your settings, levels, EQ, effects, etc. on whichever powered speakers you connect to.
I have a pair of M-Audio monitors for the studio (BX5a) which are perfect for that purpose, but not very load for gigs. For that I have the BX8a which are 130 Watts each, making it a 260 Watt setup. Very giggable. I only switch speakers and I can go from studio to stage and back with not a single knob or slider movement on the mixer.
Quite practical if you ask me

xmlguy · Post by **xmlguy** » Fri Jul 23, 2010 1:13 am

holdsg wrote:Good info xlrguy, can tell you're experienced in this area. I have gained "experience" through trial and error, and wished I had your wisdom prior to some of the errors. Yep, this thread should be required reading for any Korg-ite (or is it Korg-anism?) seeking to play live.

Glad to help! I worked for a small pro mixer company in the early 80's, and I've built mixers from the ground up from components and a soldering iron. I also started doing professional sound in the late 70s. That's when my interest in synthesizers started, from PAiA modular synth kits in the days before digital keyboards/synths. I got kinda burned out on pro sound when I realized that people only notice soundmen when they screw up, and it's a hell of a lot of work at low pay for letting the musicians get all the credit for the music. So now I only do my own sound for my own music, for my own enjoyment.

dekturrr · Post by **dekturrr** » Fri Jul 23, 2010 2:45 am

in your experience, is there a particular brand of powered speakers that you have proven durable?

xmlguy · Post by **xmlguy** » Fri Jul 23, 2010 3:16 am

dekturrr wrote:in your experience, is there a particular brand of powered speakers that you have proven durable?

I personally own a pair of Behringer B212A and Peavey PR15P, but I got them on sale for really good prices several years ago. I've personally used and tested the QSC K10, K12, and JBL PRX512M, and various JBL EONs. If I was going to buy a pair today, it would be the K10 or K12, but they're not in my personal gear budget. I got the B212A for under $200 each and they do very well. Very durable in my experience. I'd probably go for the B212D if my B212As got destroyed in a fire. The Behringer and Peavey aren't in the same class as the QSC or JBL, but they're also much cheaper and work fine for me. I also have a pair of Peavey PR10s that I use with a Behringer PMP2000 powered mixer, but just for having something for rehearsals or beating around, as I got the mixer for about $200 about 7 years ago and $120/each for the PR10s.

dekturrr · Post by **dekturrr** » Fri Jul 23, 2010 4:22 am

thaks for the input, by the way, are you familiar with the brand Beta 3? or B3? i use it, B38a powered speakers.

xmlguy · Post by **xmlguy** » Fri Jul 23, 2010 6:38 am

Sure, glad to help. I looked up Beta Three just now. It looks like it's a Chinese company that creates a wide range of pro audio speakers. I've never used them and haven't heard anything about their reliability. How do you like them? Are they 8 inch LF with a horn?

holdsg · Post by **holdsg** » Fri Jul 23, 2010 1:59 pm

I had my first experience playing thru the house PA last Saturday and the sound guys said I should have a DI box. Well I don't currently, as I said, most of the time I am in smaller venues and just play thru my own powered speakers. But if you were to recommend a DI box for keyboards, I have heard good things about the Radial JDI stereo DI. Do you have any recommendations?

holdsg · Post by **holdsg** » Fri Jul 23, 2010 2:05 pm

dekturrr wrote:in your experience, is there a particular brand of powered speakers that you have proven durable?

I have been pleased with the durability of my Yamaha MSR250. I tried the bigger MSR400 and it was too loud for my needs, but some people like that kind of thing.

Also, some in this thread have recommended the Mackie SRM450v2s. Can't really go wrong there as they are sort of the industry standard, and lots of used ones out on the market from DJ's. A bit cheaper than the QSCs.

If looking for a hot, very compact speaker, try the Electro-Voice ZXA1, it will knock your socks off for the size. I was very tempted at around $500 new.

McHale · Post by **McHale** » Fri Jul 23, 2010 3:13 pm

Don't forget that the StagePAS 250M is just an MSR250 with a 10 channel mixer attached. They are also roughly the same price.

dekturrr · Post by **dekturrr** » Sun Jul 25, 2010 1:58 pm

McHale wrote:Don't forget that the StagePAS 250M is just an MSR250 with a 10 channel mixer attached. They are also roughly the same price.

the StagePas 250M is not available in the philippines, they ony carry the stagepas 300 and 500. sad

mocando · Post by **mocando** » Sun Jul 25, 2010 3:44 pm

dekturrr wrote:
McHale wrote:Don't forget that the StagePAS 250M is just an MSR250 with a 10 channel mixer attached. They are also roughly the same price.
the StagePas 250M is not available in the philippines, they ony carry the stagepas 300 and 500. sad

The same is down here in Venezuela.

Is really odd you guys don't have it, since they are so close to Japan. Really bad.

orpheus2006 · Post by **orpheus2006** » Mon Jul 26, 2010 4:13 pm

mocando wrote:I have a pair of M-Audio monitors for the studio (BX5a) which are perfect for that purpose, but not very load for gigs. For that I have the BX8a which are 130 Watts each, making it a 260 Watt setup. Very giggable.

Using studio monitors for live performance is not a good idea. They are just not designed for this purpose. Why do you think they are called "nearfield" monitors? They sound best when you're "near" them. Maybe the BX8a are suitable for very small, solo keyboard gigs, but they aren't built for road use. I personally wouldn't use studio monitors for a live gig, ever.

PA systems project a much farther distance and also cover a wider dispersion area. I bet the BX8a will not be able to compete with drums and guitars. They will sound wimpy even when cranked up full!

BTW, according to the spec, the Bx8a has a 70 watts low-frequency amplifier and a 60 watts high-frequency amplifier power. This is in many cases not enough power. Compare e.g. the Mackies with 400W (100/300W bi-amped) at 90° dispersion!

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amplifying the m50

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