A Kronos may be getting thrown out of my window soon!

Francois · Post by **Francois** » Tue Jun 03, 2014 7:24 pm

Most people who get confused by the Kronos tend to be relatively new to Korg, or they are used to the way other synth manufacturers do things.

The reverse is true. Recently, I tried a synth from Roland and was frustrated because I couldn't find how to do certain things. Did I go to Roland Clan to say that the X was crap to program and use? Of course not. I recognise that it takes time to become used to the way things are done on that particular synth.

Spend time in the manual. A machine as complex as the Kronos (or Motif, Fantom...) cannot be expected to give instant results once you've past playing with programs and combis. Furthermore, it's not a product I would recommend to people for whom it's the first high end synth.

Stick with it, you'll be glad you did.

crazylounyc · Post by **crazylounyc** » Tue Jun 03, 2014 7:33 pm

Don't throw it out the window! I'll msg you my address and you can send it to me. I'll pay shipping.. Lol. I make sure it gets played.

Don't give up. Its an awesome instrument.

NuSkoolTone · Post by **NuSkoolTone** » Tue Jun 03, 2014 7:34 pm

Programming the Kronos is not always for the faint of heart. It's a very deep instrument. The upside is though is there is so much packed in, it will take most YEARS to "outgrow". I'm expecting 10+ years out of my Kronos before it's time to "move on".

By then I'm sure there will be a successor (or two) hopefully backward compatible. I'm hoping the Kronos will have a K2000 like legacy and lifespan. While the Sequencer is a low point, Korg has set the bar VERY high otherwise. It's been 3+ years since the Kronos release and the other players are still "Catching up" IMO. They're getting closer, but still have at least another year to go. That's a pretty darn good investment in my book!

Hal2001 · Post by **Hal2001** » Wed Jun 04, 2014 12:08 am

Don't give up. I almost did at first too with this first Korg experience. The pain is worth the gain. Between the manual, Korg customer service, and Korg forums, the answers will be there. I felt the same way with my first Roland Fantom and my first Yamaha keyboard as well. They all seemed too complicated to me at first. However, Each time perseverance and patience made it worthwhile in the end. I love the Kronos now. I think the sounds and effects are phenomenal. Hang in there and good luck.

william olson · Post by **william olson** » Wed Jun 04, 2014 1:30 am

I hear you Rabs, I feel your pain.Start out a little bit at a time.Building little by little.Don,t take on to many complex things at once.Be patient you can not master this complex beast in a short time.This forum is the greatest place to learn. When i get pi@#$d i walk away and go mountain biking. Crow feather

Rabs111 · Post by **Rabs111** » Wed Jun 04, 2014 6:52 pm

Thanks for all of your responses. I'm glad I'm not the only that is/has struggled with it. I just needed a big rant really to get it off my chest, but all the links that people have put up are brilliant!

I've never thought it was a 'crap' instrument, just not intuitive to my Yamaha Motif way of doing things. And I think I was expecting the user friendliness of an iPad.

I've owned it for a couple of months now, and used it mainly I'm conjunction with logic to write, so tend to use the Waves plugins for effects, and multi tracking on there because I just didn't want to have all of the pains of learning to do things 'in the box'. But that's what I will need to learn when I sell the motif and start gigging with the Kronos!

michelkeijzers · Post by **michelkeijzers** » Thu Jun 05, 2014 9:48 am

Actually, I don't think the Kronos is unintuitive, probably I could say the same for a Roland or Yamaha, just because I don't know those.

Of course all and possibly especially the Kronos is a very advanced instrument with a lot of options where it is easy to loose your way if you are not used to it.

But the best way is:
- Just start playing
- Then read the start guide / operational guide
- Then if you want to know more, read the reference guide (or at least some parts of it you are interested in)
- If you cannot find the answer, ask the question here.

kenackr · Post by **kenackr** » Thu Jun 05, 2014 7:24 pm

Six years and I'm on my third reading of the Oasys operating guide and still struggling, but it's getting easier. The temptation at first is just to explore the sounds and when there are almost 2000 of them, that's a big job.

Even as a nuclear engineer with both electronics and computer science degrees, it is just too much to handle all at once. For me, it's all about forcing myself to have the patience to stick my nose in the guides (both operating & parameters) and taking it one step at a time. I try to read a little each day and then apply what I read and follow the instructions as they come up to edit & program sounds, combis, etc.

Much different than sitting down at a piano to play or picking up a guitar or bass and playing.

It's not for everyone, but remember these instruments are the very top of the technical triangle of music, you are in the company of the music gods and they didn't learn it in a day either. But then again you probably don't put 6 to 8 hours a day into learning the instrument and playing it like they do either.

Go easy on yourself.

SDDP · Post by **SDDP** » Sat Jun 07, 2014 9:21 pm

I can sympathize with all of you, been using Korg since the M1 first came out and believe it or not I actually took a class at UCLA for the Korg M1 (t was an extention class).. So had a much better understanding when I got the Triton ST. but this Kronos, you literally need a Phd in Kronosology.

Wish we had user meets for these in different areas like once a month or something. I am the LA (Southern California) area. Would be so up for that.
I did meet someone who works at Guitar Center who's a Kronos genius and can give personal 1 on 1 classes but he charges like $30 an hour or something like that.

Bald Eagle · Post by **Bald Eagle** » Sat Jun 07, 2014 9:29 pm

The Korg workstation architecture is power and therefore complicated and takes some time to fully get your head around. But the one aspect I found to be really confusing was the sequencer.

Francois · Post by **Francois** » Sat Jun 07, 2014 10:04 pm

Rabs111 wrote:... just not intuitive to my Yamaha Motif way of doing things.

Exactly what I was saying. You are used to the Motif way of doing things, and now you struggle with the Korg way of doing things. And yet, both work equally well, so long as you are familiar with their paradigm.

Saying that, perhaps it's time for all manufacturers to step back and rethink what they're doing in terms of ergonomy and logic. John Bowen has shown another way with the Solaris, and as much as I love my Kronos, I derive more pleasure from programming my own sounds with the Solaris than I do with the Kronos.

Bald Eagle · Post by **Bald Eagle** » Sat Jun 07, 2014 10:15 pm

Francois wrote: Saying that, perhaps it's time for all manufacturers to step back and rethink what they're doing in terms of ergonomy and logic. John Bowen has shown another way with the Solaris, and as much as I love my Kronos, I derive more pleasure from programming my own sounds with the Solaris than I do with the Kronos.

More knobs makes for easier and more enjoyable programming. The Kronos control surface is not good for programming, just some general real time performance tweaking.

Francois · Post by **Francois** » Sat Jun 07, 2014 11:07 pm

It's not just about knobs either. Dedicated screens are also part of the equation. I've always found that a central screen to control everything is a flawed concept, simply born out of the desire to save money.

Bald Eagle · Post by **Bald Eagle** » Sat Jun 07, 2014 11:14 pm

I completely agree with that. Small screens are relatively inexpensive and a large main screen with additional smaller supplemental ones as in the Solaris are incredibly useful.

Hooch · Post by **Hooch** » Sun Jun 08, 2014 5:03 am

Korg's basic fundamental approach to program structure since the M1
has followed form through these years allowing current users a familiar upgrade path.
I applaud them for this.

I do feel your frustration though. Really. I've been staring at the k wondering how the he11 you program an LFO to do this or do a basic filter sweep in AL-1 for that. I want to get rid of this stupid thing!!!

Then I think to myself....

Let the complicated crap go and just start with the poly six. Use it like that's all you've got for awhile. You have 16 poly six's. That a lot. And a rack of 16 effects boxes to go along with it. That's a lot too.

Then explore the MS-20 the same way.
There is a ton of MS-20 tricks that you can do. Just search youtube
They will all work with the K version.
And again you have 16 of them sitting side by side to play with.

Treat the piano engine like somebody just showed up with one in your studio
and you have to mic it up and process it to sound good on a track.
Find the eq sweet spot and run through a preamp and squish it a little with a comp. etc. etc. Explore

Same with the tine piano engine.

Sampling is a bit harder but there is a lot of help available from users here.

You get the idea. You can spend a lot of time with just these and do a lot.
I've finally got stuff sounding nice and organic for my needs.

Leave AL-1, MOD-7, and STR stuff alone unless you find something that's close that someone else has conjured up.
Those 3 engines are complicated to say the least. Some people may think they are approachable but not me. They deserve their own bit of mastering to get your head rapped around them.
It can be done if you read the manuals carefully. They're still not easy.

Hope my approach helps,

John