My Kronos impressions

Arp_ · Post by **Arp_** » Tue Jul 19, 2011 12:03 pm

Today my Kronos 61 has finally arrived! And after playing it for few hours I can tell my first impressions about it.
First of all, sound quality in general is amazing. It has that "fullness" that last time Korg had in Trinity and which was lost since then in Triton and M3. Now I can hear it again in Kronos (probably was in OASYS too, but I didn't play OASYS), and it is great.
Pianos are wonderful. It's first time that I hear piano in keyboard that makes me really enjoy playing classical compositions. Dynamics, velocity response, all the noises make it feel like a real instrument instead of sample playback machine. Usually I use Galaxy II in Kontakt for my pianos, but now I can just use Kronos.
Electric pianos are great too, they can easily replace best software libraries like Scarbee IMHO. They are again best EPs I heard in a keyboard.
CX-3 organ... well, I expected something better to be honest. To me it sounds like just yet another ordinary organ emulation and I think I like KB3 mode in PC3 with latest programs a little more. It is not on par with Nord's emulation.
AL-1 is one of the best VA synths I've ever played, it has really clear sound and compares very good to my AN1X and even DSI Tetra.
Polysix & MS-20 are also good, but IMHO not as good as AL-1. They lack something to my ears, but I can't clearly describe what exactly.
STR-1 produces awesome clavinets and ethnic instruments, guitars sounds a bit fake. But for me it's an amazing sound design instrument and I will probably spend a lot of time with it.
I haven't played much with MOD-7 but it seems to produce absolutely amazing pads, also I haven't found many traditional FM sounds (apart from electric pianos) in factory programs, most of them seem to be FM/VA or FM/sample hybrids.
HD-1 is great for Trinity-like pads and atmospheres, also wave sequences are fun. There are IMHO too many HD-1 pianos/EPs that are not needed with SGX-1 and EP-1. Orchestral strings IMHO are disappointing, PC3X has much better strings. Other orchestral instruments are okay. I find guitars/basses pretty weak. Drums seem to be cool, but I haven't tested them in a mix yet.
I haven't played Combi mode a lot, but all Combis I tried were for some reason not very inspiring to me. I haven't found any combis yet that instantly made me "wow" feeling like many combis from Trinity, for example. I think I had more fun with combis in M3, but I have to play Kronos some more to form a final opinion.
Not tried Set List and Sequencer yet.
Now about some of the issues:
1. Data wheel feels weak. It didn't fall off so far, but I try not to use it much, because it feels like it will break sooner or later. Also, the vector joystick feels not very solid.
2. Screen is fine for me, but I wish it was angled more. My Kronos is on top tier and when I'm sitting, the screen is just below my eyes level, contrast in that position is not very good, though I am still able to see everything. Fonts are small, but it isn't an issue for me.
3. Fan noise is not an issue for me also. I can hear it when I am close to Kronos and want to hear it specifically, but generally it doesn't annoy me and I don't notice it if I don't want to.
4. I had a couple of strange issues right after unboxing. First of all, when I played keys for the first time, some of the keys on the right part of keyboard felt weird, like they were a bit loose. Then I hit those keys a little harder and they clicked like something inside "snapped" into place. Since then they seem to work fine and there is no loose feeling or any other strange things about keyboard. Also, before I placed Kronos in my home studio room, I just took it out of the box, put it on couch and just quickly tested with headphones (I was impatient!). During that testing it worked for about 5 minutes, then randomly rebooted itself with annoying "buzzing" sound. Then it worked again for about 2-3 minutes and rebooted second time. Maybe it was some issue with power, but anyway, now Kronos is in my studio room and it is on for about 6 hours already, and there doesn't seem to be any problems with it anymore. But it is still worrying me a bit.

jimknopf · Post by **jimknopf** » Tue Jul 19, 2011 12:29 pm

I also thought the CX3 was weak, after listeing to some pre-release demos and checking some of the first factory programs.

I now think some of them are quite misleading and don't do justice to the CX3. Try to make your own programs, in part with help of this (not translating 1:1 but giving good basic presets info):
http://www.korgforums.com/forum/phpBB2/ ... hp?t=63046

After programming my first organ sounds myself, I think the CX3 is a great clone, and KB3 certainly doesn't even come remotely near. Kurzweil just is well in programming presets, even on a weak B3clone engine basis. It's the same with their weak old samples: they make the best of it by smart patch programming.

I also contradict concerning strings: dive a bit into combinations and you will probably find some very nice examples of strings that sound definitely better than Kurzweil's for my ears. But I leave that to your taste.

I agree about E-Guitars: if anything, they seem to be the by far weakest spot of the whole Kronos sound spectrum.

Basic bass sounds are ok (Precision, Jazz bass etc.), but there could be more alternatives, modern five-strings of various brands etc.

There are lots of kicking synth basses of all kinds, many of them first class, by the way.

michelkeijzers · Post by **michelkeijzers** » Tue Jul 19, 2011 12:34 pm

I hope I like the organs, but I guess I will since I heard demos of the CX3 on youtube and sound very good (at least for me). Somehow, nordlead doesn't give me a wow factor for organs.

Going to try one myself next Saturday so I also will write a review.

Enjoy your Kronos.

LyonsT · Post by **LyonsT** » Tue Jul 19, 2011 1:28 pm

michelkeijzers wrote:Somehow, nordlead doesn't give me a wow factor for organs.

It's not made to sound like a organ it is just a synth, if you want a better organ the Nord C1, C2 or Electro keyboards would suit those factors better as that is what they aim at.

Hammond have the best clone-wheel currently in their XK, or SK keyboards. I have played them all. The CX-3 isn't a Hammond B3 (a tone-wheel which is what it is attempting to model) it's a Korg CX-3 it has its own unique sound, which is not to my taste.

Arjan · Post by **Arjan** » Tue Jul 19, 2011 1:50 pm

LyonsT wrote:The CX-3 isn't a Hammond B3 (a tone-wheel which is what it is attempting to model) it's a Korg CX-3 it has its own unique sound, which is not to my taste.

Each to their own, I have the hardware version of the CX-3 and happen to love it. Would take it any day over all the others out there, it's got more character and I agree that it has its own unique and, to my ears, musical sound. Keep in mind that I was not after 100% authenticity when I selected my clone, I just needed an organ sound with balls for progrock. I actuall auditioned the CX-3 on an Oasys because the CX-3 was no longer available in Europe due to RoHS regulartions. Had to import mine from the US.

The fact that the Kronos has an exact copy of my CX-3 (with some minor improvements which were already in the Kronos version) is one of the reasons why I might consider getting a Kronos in future, it could replace my hardware CX-3 and give me loads of additional options.

michelkeijzers · Post by **michelkeijzers** » Tue Jul 19, 2011 1:53 pm

The problem I have with my Korg M50 (and earlier Korgs) is that the range is very limited, can't get it 'fat' like a Hammond on high and low notes except with too much compromise.

Also I like the real usage of drawbars.

jimknopf · Post by **jimknopf** » Tue Jul 19, 2011 2:20 pm

For my ears the Suzuki SK3 (and Vase III in general) can sound nice in Jazz settings, but doesn't have enough bite to really rock. All in all I don't hear it ANY closer to a real B3 than the Kronos CX3 or a Roland VK8.

The Clavia clonewheel tops them all a bit with a more authentic Leslie-overdrive sound.

But as Aron said: each to their own.

EnjoyRC · Post by **EnjoyRC** » Tue Jul 19, 2011 2:22 pm

LyonsT wrote:Hammond have the best clone-wheel currently in their XK, or SK keyboards. I have played them all. The CX-3 isn't a Hammond B3 (a tone-wheel which is what it is attempting to model) it's a Korg CX-3 it has its own unique sound, which is not to my taste.

Nicely put. I agree that Hammond have done the best job of cloning themselves

. But, they fall a bit short on the overdrive simulation. Very artificial sounding. Now Korg's CX-3 overdrive/saturation sounds much more natural than the Hammond XK series.

I also agree that the Kronos CX-3 presets need a bit of tweaking. But you can make some very good organ patches when you dive in a bit. You should have seen the look on the faces of the rest of the band this past weekend when we started to jam and I pulled up a CX-3 patch. I used to only get that response when I brought my XK1 on stage.

Good job Korg!!!

EnjoyRC · Post by **EnjoyRC** » Tue Jul 19, 2011 2:26 pm

michelkeijzers wrote:The problem I have with my Korg M50 (and earlier Korgs) is that the range is very limited, can't get it 'fat' like a Hammond on high and low notes except with too much compromise.

Also I like the real usage of drawbars.

The whole reason I purchased my Hammond XK-1 is due to the weak organ sounds that came out of the M3. Most likely the same as the M50 sound sources. Extremely happy with the organs in the Kronos.

PinkFloydDudi · Post by **PinkFloydDudi** » Tue Jul 19, 2011 3:23 pm

LyonsT wrote:Hammond have the best clone-wheel currently in their XK, or SK keyboards. I have played them all. The CX-3 isn't a Hammond B3 (a tone-wheel which is what it is attempting to model) it's a Korg CX-3 it has its own unique sound, which is not to my taste.

I have to disagree on personal taste. I own a CX3 and I have played many times with the XK from Hammond. I personally like the CX3 a LOT better than the XK. The sounds from the XK seem very forced and "over-produced" to me.
Not to mention the leslie sim on the CX3 with some tweaking (IMHO) really beats the XKs. Little nuances like percussion and vibrato came up shorter for me on the XK than it did on the CX3.

With some of the tweaks people have mentioned here and in other threads - I think you might be happily surprised at the CX3 module in the Kronos!

Synthoid · Post by **Synthoid** » Tue Jul 19, 2011 3:30 pm

Arp_ wrote:I haven't played Combi mode a lot, but all Combis I tried were for some reason not very inspiring to me. I haven't found any combis yet that instantly made me "wow" feeling

How well is KARMA implemented in the combis?

michelkeijzers · Post by **michelkeijzers** » Tue Jul 19, 2011 3:34 pm

According to most people I can assume the CX3 is depending on personal taste but far better than the M3/M50 Korg and before.

I like the flexibility and allround sound character of Korg so that's why I like to stick with that. Also, I'm used to the interface so actually the only 'competitor' I would take into account is Yamaha but even tough they say Yamaha has better acoustic sounds I still like the expressiveness and 'bite' of Korg sounds mostly.

padking · Post by **padking** » Tue Jul 19, 2011 6:38 pm

As far as Karma is concern, in my opinion
it's much weaker then on the M3, often you
change scene and nothing happens,

The Combis of the Kronos are not very good
compare to the M3.

In fact I found more interesting things on the
program

Padking

Arp_ · Post by **Arp_** » Sat Jul 23, 2011 5:32 pm

I tried programming my own CX3 presets, and yes, it's really possible to make it sound better than factory presets. Now I quite like it.
Also, I found out that "Vintage Keyboards" expansion is actually piano/EP/clav samples that were introduced in M3 XPanded upgrade. They are mostly redundant, but the clavinet sounds are really nice. I wonder if it's possible to load only clav samples from it while not loading pianos and EPs to save some memory?

Synthoid wrote:How well is KARMA implemented in the combis?

Well, programming-wise Karma is all over them, almost every combi has several tracks with Karma, all the controls are intelligently assigned to its parameters, etc, so technically it's implemented really good.
But I just can't understand what to do with it!

I cannot find what to play along with this Karma-generated music, I try one melody, another, or different chord progression, etc, and I cannot make it sound not awkward. It's like Karma in Kronos wants to reject all my ideas.
I had M3 before I got Kronos and it was much easier to get along with M3's combis. But to be honest, I prefer plain combis without a lot of auto-generated stuff, like they were in Triton/Trinity/etc.

McHale · Post by **McHale** » Sat Jul 23, 2011 5:51 pm

PinkFloydDudi wrote:I own a CX3 and I have played many times with the XK from Hammond. I personally like the CX3 a LOT better than the XK.

+1.

Have had several CX-3's and overall, I preferred it over the XK1 and XK3. The XK3c is a little better but still preferred the CX-3.

The Kronos CX-3 engine can perfectly match the hardware counterpart.

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